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Old 12-07-2007, 08:18 PM   #31
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Just called CS - They said this change, ie adding fees - does not enable a cancellation of the service without an EFT charge.
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Old 12-07-2007, 08:23 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by Memphis213 View Post
HERE IS THE DEAL:

As of yesterday, 12/6/07, sprint was waiving ETFs for canceling because of this.

As of today, 12/7/07, This problem is being reviewed by the sprint legal department for discussion. CSR reps were sent an e-mail today NOT to waive the ETF for this type of cancellation, and apparently I was the first one my rep had talked to about it yet. Sprint is trying to keep this hush hush as long as they can, this is a classic stall tactic by corporations who understood they were required to make a move they did not want to because of the obvious ramifications. Be patient it will come.

REMINDER
PAYING YOUR SPRINT BILL IS AN AUTOMATIC ACCEPTANCE OF THESE TERMS.

Also, I have never understood the hostility whenever this topic is brought up. This is an OBVIOUS breach of contract, are there any other legal professionals here who can finally back me up!?
These changes are CORE charge changes, these are not governmentally mandates fees, these are fees sprint is choosing to recollect. Why you say would sprint change its fees as such? This is just renaming and relocation. They are not getting rid of the first fee, they are relocating it due to lawsuits pending about their previous fees.

Some of us only want this so we can receive half of what new customers are offered and maybe some of these wonderful plans that only the multi-line holders, and angry CSR callers. I personally would prefer to stay with sprint, but on an OOC basis. Maybe then I could get half of the support, discounts, and bed of roses the new customers get.

these .90 cent fees dont seem much on the micro level, but if you look at this from a macro perspective and multiply that .90 cents per customer per month per year, sprint is reclaiming millions in fees from its customers to pay its required licensing and regulatory fees. For example, I own a Restaurant and we become so busy that we must call in another chef to come on. To offset that cost, I decide that everyone that has already ordered will have the price of their food increased by 0.90$. Now it doesn't seem fair in the situation? That is because we are on a personal level with the problem, when right the person who is making the policy decision is a material thing, instead of a corporate logo... why do we let these companies push with us as a mass from a distance?

This isn't a sprint issue, this is a cell phone company issue. There is not one other utility service you must make a yearly commitment too. This is not a membership to an exclusive clue. This is your product, your wares, your money. And we the customers represent every dollar on every zero of any sprint employee, shareholder or partners paycheck. Earn it.

When you keep your customers like prisoners, don't be surprised that they run when the gate is opened.

im glad as of right now i have a $600 credit so i wont be paying my bill until march 08 :-) keep us posted because im pretty sure i want to drop my 3rd line and convert it to a nextel or hybrid phone (probably on sero)
 
Old 12-07-2007, 08:38 PM   #33
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I have just received confirmation. On the first bill that contains the new surcharges, customers will be allowed to leave and their ETF will be waived. The reasoning for no post dated cancellations is that sprint "must see the change has affected you in specific"......
...Now since this is a company wide surcharge, EVERY customer will be affected, therefore this is to keep customer at least until the holiday buying season is over IMHO.

Now if you pay your bill, upgrade your phone, etc. etc. etc. any of these could be "agreement" to the new policies. I am going to continue as the fact that you cannot schedule your plan to expire before the changes affect you doesn't sit well with me. Tomorrow I will continue to fish for information.
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Old 12-08-2007, 03:54 AM   #34
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an adverse change would be a change that increases the fee's. If sprint add's new fee's a month before removing the old ones, then it would be an adverse change for everyone.

If sprint is raising your fee's, its an adverse change. if they are lowering your fee's, it is not an adverse change.

An ETF free cancellation really depends on if the fee's will overlap, and absent that if you will have a net increase or decrease. If sprint chooses to let everyone cancel, it is their right to do so but not their responsibility.

As far as being held hostage by a sprint contract....... you can purchase wireless service that does not require a contract. Therefore, getting contracted sprint service was your choice.
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Old 12-08-2007, 05:54 AM   #35
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I am an OOC customer who gets e-billing so I haven't seen anything. But how do e billed customers get notified? Also it seems to me a dodgy time to change the terms of service, because who's going to sit and read all that during the holiday season. I was actually thinking about getting another line but no way now. Seems to me that Sprint is very reactive instead of proactive. They make the changes and then when people start cancelling, then they start thinking about all the ramifications.

I also think Dan is spot on about choosing to be a Sprint customer. But in my case I had Virgin mobile when everyone one else I knew had Sprint. They ( my parents and six siblings) all had mobile to mobile and calling me used up anytime minutes. So the social pressure of them saying " get sprint cause you're costing us money" was pretty strong. Strong enough that I deal with Sprint's subpar service. On the other hand I was able to get Sero so I am actually paying about the same as I was before. But if they would all leave sprint...I'd be gone. That's how it goes in families and business with sprint.
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Old 12-08-2007, 05:58 AM   #36
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Bad Sprint bad.... especially at a time when your biggest competitor has one of the (if not THE) most popular phone ever.... iPhone.
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Old 12-08-2007, 06:19 AM   #37
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The changes I have seen look like the average customer would have a net decrease in their bill. If that is the case, sprint is not bad at all!

Other changes to the terms and conditions dealt with how to get the unlock code for your PCS device if you wanted to take it to verizon, etc. As sprint would be allowing you to get the unlock code, this would not seem to have an adverse effect on you.

Also, it seems that sprint is trying to simplify the rates it charges for administrative fees and make it so they can all be added to the base price, therefore helping to make the true monthly bill easier to estimate for a new customer.
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Old 12-08-2007, 08:56 AM   #38
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Actually, my December bill shows that they did not collect a line item for "Federal Programs Cost Recovery" That means that the bill will go up for me by .45 per line.

I suspect they dropped the Federal Programs Cost Recovery line in response to the class action lawsuit. It isn't a charge that they are removing, it is an "illegal" charge that they never should have been adding. Therefore, they are really increasing everyone's bill by .95.

The other more related change between 2007 and 2008 is in the Surcharge section. The 2007 version lists these surcharges as costs pass on by various regulatory agencies, while the 2008 adds the vague concept of various administrative fees.
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Old 12-08-2007, 10:22 AM   #39
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Here we go again. Whiners and complainers wanting out of their contract. You people really need to get a life if you sit around and find out that Sprint is LOWERING monthly costs and yet still ask to be opted out. Forget about it, it won't happen.
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Old 12-08-2007, 10:36 AM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan View Post
As far as being held hostage by a sprint contract....... you can purchase wireless service that does not require a contract. Therefore, getting contracted sprint service was your choice.

Line 1 Mogul! (primary) $50 / 1000 shared AT, 6pm nights, FIMF, roaming on all lines TEP ($7) PVision pic pack with UL text ($15) #2 Mogul #2! $0 AAP, PVision pic pack with UL text ($0) TEP ($7) #3 A740 $10 AAP, TEP ($7) Vision pic pack with 100 txt ($5) #4 A920 $10 AAP Powervision ($7.50) 500 texts ($0) TEP ($7)
yeah i wouldn't be pissed at all either . Its funny how its always the people who have either A. Already done their *****ing to get what they want and now have DREAM PLANS, who tell everyone else how wrong they are for wanting out of contract. or B. The people who have so much money it doesnt affect them.
Look at your plans, look at your phones, get off your constant soapbox against anyone trying to get OOC, remember obviously you were one of us at one point, I don't understand where any of this always comes from unless sprint is monitoring this board and your are an obvious CSR, or giving the board owner incentives to not assist in these type of discussion.

The very fact sprint has sent out company wide e-mails, it doesn't matter if the fee's are an increase of a decrease, legally, there will be an adjustment to non-standard, non-governmentally regulated fees. This is grounds for a breach of contract and sprint is obviously well aware of it, judging by their reactions. They are choosing to recollect, CHOOSING, CHOOSING, key word key word key word.

You forget getting contracted was a choice, but the ridiculous treatment of customers after they become so was not, its unreal. This is not a sprint specific problem and every time this opportunity comes up, FOR ANY CARRIER, I will be there to assist. The lack of discount on phones to new customers, the giving of the beneficial plans to the whole who scream and complain, the lawsuits, the .90/cents per 1,500,000 subscribers, the 13 million collected over the course of a year to repay SPRINTS FINANCIAL OBLIGATIONS. They are choosing to recollect the fee's they incur in giving me cell phone service, and I am choosing to recollect the fees I incur while they give cell phone service. But since they have a wider range of pockets to pick from they can get away with a 90 cents while i need a 200$ discount on a new phone? HOW IS THIS ANY DIFFERENT????

My contract was resigned after 2 YEARS as a sprint customer. I was OOC, when I chose to change my plan. No notification given, one day I call thinking I am OOC, and boom 2 more years. So actually once sprint gets your name, they non-informative customer service, combined with unexperienced call center staff and aggressive resigning bonuses. Lead to what you see in front of you. So was it really my choice? or the thousands of others who needed a new phone, but would pay more in ETF's than the ****ty "new for you" discounts would save them, so they were STUCK. This is what I mean, did they have a choice? After your initial decision to pick a provider... Do you really ever have a choice????

So if you have no reason to leave sprint this thread should not interested you. Give me your plan and the discounts you got on those phones, and I will gladly stay in contract. Or is forcing CSRs to give you these incentives somehow more morally acceptable than going after the corporate center itself? Until then, all of you dream plan people really have no business in this, considering you have what we are trying to get.

Jan. 1st, 2008. This will be an exception to the ETF, read your bills, find either administrative fee, or regulatory fee. You are well within your legal rights to leave. Just as we are not within our legal rights to leave when sprint does not breach its contract. Hard to feel bad for a company who is forced to make this change due to millions in over collected funds from its previous surcharges.

Last edited by Memphis213; 12-08-2007 at 10:39 AM.
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Old 12-08-2007, 11:24 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by btrav13 View Post
Here we go again. Whiners and complainers wanting out of their contract. You people really need to get a life if you sit around and find out that Sprint is LOWERING monthly costs and yet still ask to be opted out. Forget about it, it won't happen.
Lets start with this recently misused phrase "lowering monthly costs"

Quote:
Originally Posted by cnn.com
Sprint PCS, for example, has about 17.9 million customers who began paying an additional 63 cents per month in July, generating $11.3 million per month for "cost recovery."
Quote:
Originally Posted by cnn.com
With 34.6 million subscribers, Verizon's estimate suggests that it expects monthly portability expenses of up to $5.2 million, or less than half the amount Sprint will be collecting per month.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cnn.com
Although costs surely vary among the different companies, government officials and industry analysts say there is little reason to expect those expenses to vary widely as the carriers upgrade systems and create verification processes similar to those that long-distance phone companies use when a customer switches from one service to another.
Lets do some math...

.70 (New administrative Fee)x 17.9 million: 12.53 million dollars/PER MONTH
.20 (New regulatory Fee)x 17.9 million: 3.58 million dollars/PER MONTH

So while it seems sprint is adding/taking away fees to balance out. Which truly they are not per:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sprint.com
Service Fee – Ending December 31, 2007
This Service fee is $1.15 per line per month. The fee is a rate adjustment of the monthly access rate and reflects the costs of providing services associated with Nextel's wireless cellular, Nextel® Walkie-Talkie and data services. In the future, this fee may be combined with the monthly access rate after billing system adjustments are completed.
They are relocating that fee. So lets go by what is really happening. Sprint is adjusting its fees that it should not have been able to start collecting in the first place but because of the concept monopoly by the cell phone industry and the relatively small charges on an individual level, no one has ever bother to care. On a macroscopic level this is a huge ploy.

Sprint was scolded by legal organizations for their obviously miscollection of their fees which has forced them to change them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cnn.com
Thereafter, if Sprint's ongoing expenses for number portability are similar to those indicated by Verizon and Cingular, Sprint's "recovery" fee may generate more than $5 million in extra monthly revenue.

Nextel, which has already collected more than $200 million to cover various regulatory costs, said it has spent "more than $100 million" in preparation for portability, but has declined to quantify its expenditures.

Cingular's average fee of 50 cents for all regulatory-related costs approximates what Sprint collects for number portability alone.
Anyone else still think .45 cents, 90 cents a customer is a small amount?

The only reason sprint is changing the names of their fees is because they cannot justify "recovering" costs for those terms, even in the most pathetic legal sense, since they not only have capped and exceeded their costs, but were churning out monthly profits because of it.

Just a .01 increase in every single customers bill would net a 1.7 million dollar profit. Its like every single person who is a sprint customer has that damn take a penny jar and sprint is simultaneously taking .20-1$ from everyone per month.

And this is a materially adverse change in either way whether it technically "loses or saves you money you werent suppose to be giving them in the first place"??? Give me a break. This is a consistent tool used by business with a subscriber base.

So which fee are we offsetting with early termination fees??? Because you just might be able to use your 5 Million monthly profit to cover that 100$ discount me and 50,000 other people just recieved, or 600,000 yearly. And lets not forget when they capped their losses... so now we are talking about a 12.5 mil/monthly profit. or 125,000 people monthly or around 1,500,000 yearly.
And since you are already recovering your costs from the new subscribers in the form of contracts....
Do the math on your own. I'm tired now. I would love to hear how this still is not materially adverse changes REGARDLESS of a net gain or loss in the total surcharges. It is only a net gain to them either way.


Hmmm....Did sprint watch office space?




Cnn.com reference article: http://www.cnn.com/2003/TECH/biztech....ap/index.html

Last edited by Memphis213; 12-08-2007 at 11:41 AM.
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Old 12-08-2007, 11:50 AM   #42
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The breakdown:

It is a materially adverse change.
Sprint is going to try to argue it isn't.
Lots of people will go "IF YOU MULTIPLY SPRINT'S PROFIT ON THIS LINE ITEM BY EVERYONE THEN SPRINT WILL MAKE 80 BILLION DOLLARS IN THREE DAYS".
If you are firm and consistent with Sprint's CSRs they will let you terminate your plan ETF-free but they will not let you just drop off your contract.

This will all happen again when they roll these 'fees' into the base monthly rate and we'll have another thread that goes through 20 pages of Internet Law.
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Old 12-08-2007, 12:48 PM   #43
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Sprints current policy as read by account services:
"On Jan. 1st 2008 Sprint customers who have been affected by the fees, [consumer and IL customers], will have their ETF waived if they wish to terminate their contract. There will be no post-dating of cancellation where the ETF will be waived as only customers affected by the new surcharges will be eligible."


This means most likely that corporate accounts will not be able to leave because sprint will not be charging surcharges to their accounts period. They will only be billing consumer and IL customers for the new fees so their corporate accounts will not have a chance to opt-out. Not too positive on all that though. Got a new number to call for Monday, the fact you cannot cancel until the very policy you do not want to be affected by, affects you, doesn't quite sit well with me.
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Old 12-08-2007, 01:58 PM   #44
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Hmm I Love retentions now
There must be some truth to this being an option out...
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Old 12-08-2007, 03:45 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis213 View Post
Sprints current policy as read by account services:
"On Jan. 1st 2008 Sprint customers who have been affected by the fees, [consumer and IL customers], will have their ETF waived if they wish to terminate their contract. There will be no post-dating of cancellation where the ETF will be waived as only customers affected by the new surcharges will be eligible."


This means most likely that corporate accounts will not be able to leave because sprint will not be charging surcharges to their accounts period. They will only be billing consumer and IL customers for the new fees so their corporate accounts will not have a chance to opt-out. Not too positive on all that though. Got a new number to call for Monday, the fact you cannot cancel until the very policy you do not want to be affected by, affects you, doesn't quite sit well with me.
Just called CSR, who said that I have to call back in January to have the ETF waived. He said that ETF will be waived for all Sprint customers but not Nextel.
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