sprint-vision for laptop use? sprints fuzzy issue...

[alchemist]

All,

Ive been a sprint customer since WAY back... my first sprint phone was a Qualcomm 2760 that I used with a digital phone card to connect to my notebook or my hp jornada 545 handheld.

I payed $10 a month for 'Wireless Web' which gave me VERY PRIMATIVE web browsing on the phone, and the ability to connect with a computer at the amazing max speed of 14.4k. usually much slower.

Then came sprint PCS Vision... which muddies the waters for me. You can get unlimited vision for $15 (was $10 when i got it, but now they charge $15 and tack on $5 credit toward services you wont use) with speeds up to 144k.

Heres my problem. I use my phone about 90% of the time by itself, but occasionally want to hook it up to my laptop when out of town. I could do this without problems on the old wireless web, but now sprint 'threatens' that you cant use your unlimited vision for a laptop... instead you need to spend up to $100 a month for a per megabyte plan that i wont use 9 months out of the year.

I see here on these forums that alot of people seem to connect their phones to their notebooks... has anyone got a nastygram from Sprint about their vision usage?

Overall im happy with sprints coverage... and havent had to deal with their CS people much... but have thought about moving to TMobile because of this issue... at least their plan is a flat $19.95 for unlimited use for whatever you want service.

Sprints answer seems to be, offer unlimited but dont offer any connection kits and definitely (no matter how much misdirection we need to employ) release any bluetooth phones. Im thinking the real problem might be that Sprint can't meter their bandwidth usage... so in reality have no idea how much any given vision user uses... would explain a bit about their model.

Well, enough of my jumping around... anyone have any enlightenment about using vision with a notebook or palm, without getting the sprint police after you? I also need to move to a family plan with multiple phones soon and that will require a contract so trying to figure out where to go when that happens.

Thanks in advance.

[alchemist]

No one have any experience to share?

[powertoburn]

I use my Samsung A600 phone with my PowerBook occassionally. So far in a month I would average about 30 - 50 megs. I just got the service so no nastygram yet. The speed for me average is 122-144 with no problems. The latency is slow but once the page loads it rapidly comes up. Sprint does compress the graphics quite a bit though.

[Wirefree]

For light use you should have no problem. I have heard that you should keep your usage under 200mb/month.

[sbiz]

Wirelessly posted (Sanyo 8100: Mozilla/4.0 (MobilePhone SCP-8100/US/1.0) NetFront/3.0 MMP/2.0)

These are several threads beginning in August from those who were warned by Sprint or those whose service was cancelled. Seems under 150-200megs per month is unofficially OK.

[Dan Souza]

A Vision Specialist told me on the phone that if you go over 150 mb, the first time they'll send you a letter, the 2nd time they'll cancel your vision and you will never be able to get it back

[klintman]

from sprintpcs.com...

PCS Vision. Sprint may deny or terminate service without notice where use is in connection with server devices or host computer applications, other systems that drive continuous heavy traffic or data sessions, or as substitutes for private lines or frame relay connections. PCS Vision Packs are: (a) only available with a Vision capable PCS Phone or PCS smart phone device; and (b) not available with Connection Cards, Aircards, or any other device used in connection with a computer or PDA - including phones, smart phones or other devices used with connection kits or similar phone-to-computer/PDA accessories. PCS Vision Packs are also not available with Bluetooth Vision capable PCS Phones used as a modem in connection with other devices. Sprint reserves the right to deny or to terminate service without notice for any misuse. PCS Vision Pack credits for premium services do not carry forward.

.....

that doesn't seem very fuzzy to me. pcs vision packs are only for pcs phones. basically... you're sucking up space on cell towers, precious little space in some cases. i believe this policy is in the best interest of all sprint users.

[alchemist]

klintman,

Your correct... thats sprints official policy and has been since vision was launched. The problem is the move to vision went a step backward for those who used sprints network for data, as sprint no longer offers any middle ground. You either have unlimited vision with NO DATA USAGE FOR A HANDHELD OR LAPTOP or you pay $40-$80 a month for an per mb data plan with a connection card which doesnt include ANY minutes for voice calling.

There are alot of folks out there that need 'casual' data access. Im one of them... they dont use data with their notebooks every day but a few times a year they might be away from home and need to do so. Back in the ole days of sprint they had the wireless web which was $10 a month for unlimited data usage... it was slow but you could use it for anything you wanted. Alot of people, myself included upgraded to a new plan got a vision phone and found out our unlimited data (still $10 a month) was no longer usable with our notebooks.

What alot of people want is unlimited vision with the ability to use it for 'casual' data usage with a notebook. Sprint doesnt officially offer this... but they unofficially turn the other way when it is done unless you abuse things and over use bandwidth.

Im upset with sprint for upgrading my plan to vision and disabling my ability to do notebook connections 'officially' if i need to... and dont like the current 'look the other way' policy... Id like sprint to address this shortfall in their service... unfortunately they dont seem to want to do that.

Right now sprints data billing is a mess...

First theres the $15 unlimited vision packs... all they did was take the $10 a month vision, and up it to $15 then give you a $5 credit toward purchasing stuff from them. Basically sprint didnt have enough faith in the sales of their added value content so they force you to buy it. Greedy!

Second, theres the 'only use it on a phone' thing that makes it impossible to officially use data occasionally on a notebook if you need to. Which is further complicated by the 'if you want the rebate on a new sprint vision capable phone, you have to buy vision on your plan' which makes it more expensive to buy a vision phone... not add vision service, then get charged the 2cent per k for data as its used. Also this method of using data which you might need 10% of the time screws you out of not only the rebate on the phone, but also out of being able to get unlimited vision on the phone.

Third the rates are inconsistent. Sprint+Vision with a Treo 300 is $15 a month. Now take the same setup... but replace the Treo 300 with phone+cable+TungstenT palm handheld... now its $40 a month + your voice plan, and instead of unlimited data its now limited to a number of mb per month.

Fourth, theres the whole bluetooth mess. First they cant seem to get a bluetooth phone out the door, even though all their GSM/GPRS competitors have had them for over a year. Then theres that little clause in the sprint notice you posted. 'PCS Vision Packs are also not available with Bluetooth Vision capable PCS Phones...' so this perfect data solution for connecting to a pda or notebook is not available with vision. but then i bet if a bluetooth phone comes along it will be a vision phone... so you cant get the rebate unless you buy vision with the plan.

I originally went with sprint about few years ago solely because of their data solutions. Overall i still like the sprint service, i get great connections and have good coverage. But sprint is no longer the leader in data connectivity... the sad thing is that they are still on the cutting edge from a technical point of view... have among the fastest connections, etc. but their marketing really drops the ball on data. Its like they market data to the bandwidth hungry businessman, and vision to the masses... but theres nothing in between.

Not sure how sprint can clean this up... they could for example count all phone usage as unlimited, then charge whatever per K for data pulled from an external device... but that would screw PDA users who went with BluetoothPhone+PDA versus getting a smartphone (same functionality and bandwidth draw, just two devices instead of one).

They could also say 'Unlimited Vision' figure what the maximum a phone is likely to pull down a month. Say 50mb or whatever. They would want this kinda high, since they wanna sell their value added content to the phone. Then they could officially say 'any bandwidth usage in excess of 50mb will be charged at 2cents per k' or whatever.

Or they could just offer another type of vision pack. $15 a month... unlimited vision on the phone, 5mb data usage on external devices.. additional bandwidth charged at a rate of 2 cents per k.

There are alot of ways to handle it... right now their choice is to look the other way... which confuses and frustrates casual data users, or if you just look at the official line on the subject it sends people off to other carriers... like t-mobile for example which offers unlimited data for whatever you want to use it for at a rate of $19.95 a month. No guesses, no am i gonna get by with this or are the sprint police gonna get me.

It can be argued now that PCS is faster than GPRS but GPRS will be upgraded to EDGE and its likely their plans will stay similar so sprint really needs to get the ball rolling here before they get left to far behind.


well enough of my novel.

[shank]

I have an i330, use Eudora for remote wireless POP3 email access, and would like to use it as a wireless modem during a business trip next week.

My shared plan was all messed up, but I believe it is now configured as the primary line, with unlimited Vision. Provided I don't go crazy downloading porn and listening to streaming music, should I expect a big bill or troubles from Sprint if I do so?

[alchemist]

Thats the question/problem isnt it. Officially, yes you should hear from the sprint police about your data usage if you use the i330 as a modem. In reality if you dont use too much bandwidth you are 'probably' ok.

Thats what I have a problem with... 'probably' ok, unless sprint gets a whim and comes after you. There should be a way of doing this that isnt black market or prohibitively expensive compared to other providers.

Ive heard as a rule of thumb, that less than 150mb a month goes under sprints radar... but nothings written in stone... thats the problem.

[klintman]

well... again i'm gonna have to say that if you use the plan legitimately you have nothing to worry about. perhaps sprint is letting things slide for people who have older plans for legal reasons. perhaps they let some people get away with it and others not. i can agree that there would be some frustration about all this. but i can also argue that you can't complain because you shouldn't be doing it anyway.

the bottom line is that sprint doesn't support it. if they did, you all wouldn't be having to post here because sprint would tell you how to do it. so if they don't support it, then... well you get my point.

since they have made the decision to leave phone modems in the past, i think sprint may have some sort of "grace" available as long as you aren't using too mush network resources. how many times do you get a network busy error? again, i think it's in the best interest of everyone as a whole.

p.s. i must say that i just moved to a new area and am new sprint pcs. i had another carrier before and simply used them to talk on my phone... what a concept. :-)

[klintman]

this can go in circles forever.

um.. alchemist. i don't think it's a step backward. i think sprint has been doing this for a while and thus have been able to make decisions accordingly. i don't think they took away modem usage to piss people off... they did it because... well they believe that's what they needed to do to stay in business. to keep the network as stable as possible (which i'll admit can be hard to do at times). to keep their customers connected.

maybe the plans are screwy... but you've gotta admit they're pretty darn good compared to some others. and i'd like to see how lond t-mobile keeps those plans going.

why would you want to buy a treo 300 and then hook it up to a tungsten?

and sprint still does give you the ability you use a phone modem in 2g. i know a few people who have absolutely no problem with that. they were offered 3g but when they found out about the no modem deal they stuck with 2g... knowing it was slower.

anyway... misinformation happens anywhere you go. heck cingular tried to sell me a "satellite" phone when they went gsm.

anyway. sprint knows if your using your phone as a modem. i mean... cdma is based on esn authentication. that kinda gives it away. i guess be grateful if you break the rules and get away with it. :-)

[alchemist]

this can go in circles forever.

Its more of a two steps forward, one step back kinda thing. You used to be able to take advantage of all their service features and do data with your laptop from time to time... now you cant.

I dont think it has much at all to do with network stability... they are encouraging network usage... they support unlimited photo spamming, they have high bandwidth data plans and they are moving to faster technologies to compete with broadband down the road. The real problem goes back to the launch of Vision... at that time they didnt have a good way of metering how much bandwidth vision used... so they switched to unlimited at the last minute... and started pulling connection kits off the shelves.

>>maybe the plans are screwy... but you've gotta admit they're >>pretty darn good compared to some others. and i'd like to see >>how lond t-mobile keeps those plans going.

Sprints aware of the shortcoming in this area... thats why they look the other way and you get 10 different responses if you ask the same questions 10 times. Cell phones are becoming more and more data centric... IMO the days of special cards and cables to connect phones to your laptop are numbered... its one of the big advantages GPRS has over sprint at the moment... and its only going to get worse for sprint when EDGE hits the US. All id like to see is for sprint to get off their arse and officially address the issue. Ive seriously considered going to t-mobile for just this reason... and the idea that i like the SIM card idea so i could have a 'junk' phone to take on fishing trips without paying sprint $35+ before the trip and then again after the trip to switch between the two phones. (sprint needs to address that one too)

>>why would you want to buy a treo 300 and then hook it up to >>a tungsten?

You might want to take another look at my post. What i said was the pricing was inconsistant between using a palm phone (like a treo 300) and using a vision phone connected to a palm via cable or bluetooth. They are both capable of pulling the same bandwidth, but the treo is MUCH cheaper to operate using sprints official pricing (ie $40 instead of $15).

>>and sprint still does give you the ability you use a phone >>modem in 2g. i know a few people who have absolutely no >>problem with that. they were offered 3g but when they found >>out about the no modem deal they stuck with 2g... knowing it >>was slower.

Yea, you can stay in the past... thats slower than just about anything else out there... phones get low battery life because of the tech used... bigger, heavier... not taking advantage of any advances sprint has made to make them competitive with the other carriers. That doesnt sound like a solution to me that sounds like a reason to jump carriers.

>>anyway. sprint knows if your using your phone as a modem. i >>mean... cdma is based on esn authentication. that kinda gives >>it away. i guess be grateful if you break the rules and get >>away with it. :-)

Actually i havent broken the rules... at least not yet. I currently have a treo 300 (equip replacement for my kyocera 6035) and luckily havent had a need to connect to my laptop recently. But the idea that i cant if i want to is bothersome. If i do it... i wont be charged by the 'k'... it will either be ignored, or ill get a visit from the sprint police... neither of those options is acceptable to me. The mere fact of buying unlimited vision because thats what ill use 90% of the time, removes my ability to use data and be charged by the 'k' thus creating the whole gray area.

Ive been thinking seriously of moving to T-Mobile. Unlimited data for $19.95 a month with no surprises on what its used for. Go with a Nokia 3650 phone with bluetooth. Connnect to my notebook whenever i need to... or to a handheld (tungsten T3 is leading candidate right now).

Why havent i switched alreadY? surely not because of sprints service and plans... mainly its because my cell is my main phone... canceled my landline a long time ago... and I have a sprint tower within about 500 yards of my house. I get great reception. Better than im likely to get with another carrier.

As you said we can go round and round on this. I dont agree that anything sprint has done regarding data was done 'for the benefit of all' to keep everyone talking. Sprint is pushing data... they just arent dealing with this particular group of people. From what ive heard from a few sprint reps its more a case of their system isnt equipped to track the bandwidth so they dont, and any non-unlimited system would require bandwidth tracking.

[klintman]

you're right... this can go on forever.

i don't see why someone whould say bandwidth tracking isn't setup. 3g is packet-data based. it's certainly possible to implement a bandwidth tracking system, QoS, firewalls, the whole deal. if not bandwidth tracking, they do have what they call bandwidth optimization.

anyway, i put in my two cents. :-)

[alchemist]

I honestly dont know if they can track bandwidth now or not. All ive been able to confirm recently is that using the phone as a modem comes in on a different port so they can tell when you aer doing that versus using the phone alone.

When vision originally launched though, it was a few months late and they were pressed to get it out the door. They went to unlimited vision at the last minute... before that it was going to be metered by bandwidth. I talked to a sprint tech about it and was told they didnt have bandwidth metering setup so went unlimited so they could launch without it. they might have it by now for all I know.

[dstrauss]

Originally posted by alchemist
Thats the question/problem isnt it. Officially, yes you should hear from the sprint police about your data usage if you use the i330 as a modem. In reality if you dont use too much bandwidth you are 'probably' ok.

Thats what I have a problem with... 'probably' ok, unless sprint gets a whim and comes after you. There should be a way of doing this that isnt black market or prohibitively expensive compared to other providers.

Ive heard as a rule of thumb, that less than 150mb a month goes under sprints radar... but nothings written in stone... thats the problem.

Lots of luck, alchemist.

I've been pressing (email; calls; Sprint stores; etc.) for Sprint to blend a Vision pack for business users. Given that unlimited data on their aircard is $80 per month, but no voice ($0.20 per minute to make a voice call) and regular vision is $15, why can't they implement a $20-25 solution like T-mobile's unlimited data for any source (phone; PDA; modem). The general answer, when they'll talk about it, is T-Mobile's network is no better than the old 14.4k wireless web, so go there if you want, but we're not going to budge (absent competition). Needless to say, with all my complaints, I'm probably on their watch list.

In some ways you can't blame them - I've seen young turks on this and other forums crowing how they got away with mega-gig Kazaa downloads on their Sprint accounts. The existing bandwidth just can't support being an ISP replacement. Now you can see why they won't release a bluetooth phone - how much easier could it get to "steal" bandwidth if you didn't even need a cable.

There is one legitimate work-around if you have either an i500 or Treo 600. Use the phone exclusively to attach to the Vision network, and invest in Snappermail and Docs to Go Premier. You can then get your email and attachments (memory shortage can become a problem on the i500) and then either sync or use IR to transfer the files to and from your notebook. Still no decent web surfing (my eyes are too old for that tiny screen). The other is to use a PPC smartphone (a little better surfing) and do the same thing with actiivesync - but Pocket Word and Excel seem to mangle attachments more than Docs to Go - and unless you're ready for a smartphone with no touch screen, the units are substantially larger and more PDA-centric than the i500 or T600.

Both are definite kludges, but you never connected to the Sprint network as a modem on your notebook.

[81002004]

Alchemist, you said you were able to confirm that they can disinguish Vision usage from #777 laptop dialier connection calls? Where did you hear this?

If so, then why don't they just ban those connections? I don't understand why they would go out of their way to allow it just so they can send you a nasty email and then cancel you and lose a customer. Not only that but when you have a vision phone, they POST a link on your home page (when you sign in) to download their SprintDialer program that allows exactly THIS connection FROM a Vision phone. That link has been on my software page for over a year. They just revised their site, did they remove it?

From what I've read they can't disinguish Vision phone, from Vision laptop since it's the same phone and username and connection method. The phone paired with special cables/software allows the computer browser/etc. to run instead of the internal java browser/applications.

Back in the day of wireless web, the phone was simply a modem calling out to something like NetZero vs being "an always connected ISP service" ...

So, Alchemist you keep saying that you want the Old Web Connectivity. Have you tried using the dialer and simply dialing out to something like NetZero? Does that not work? Future Dial says that it's possible, though you'll get a lower bandwidth (9600-14.4) consistent with the old Wireless Web. Also, as before it would come off of your minutes, but be unlimited data.

With everyone saying that 150mb/month is a good estimate of what not to go over, I can only assume they can tell bandwidth. I'm sure if you used the in-phone vision service enough (constant downloads), you could easily hit this limit as well and they'd also send you the nasty note. When I switched to vision I never saw a paper agreement and was just told that all vision service is unlimited. Also, since they directly provided me the software and told me where to buy the cable. I can't imagine them coming after me for using it. That would sure be a good reason to demand a refund and switch companies.

Anyway, just my two cents. Comments are welcome.

[klintman]

actually, when you connect with a dial up network connection on a laptop, you are actually connecting through a different subsystem (which provides dial tone, etc.). in theory, you should be able to block certain devices (depending on the device's esn) from accessing the dial-up subsytem, but i'm not sure why sprint doesn't do this.

[alchemist]

I havent actually tried connecting to the internet via a laptop using my vision service.... I know it can be done, and it also says in their terms of service that its for phone use ONLY, external devices cost extra.

The very facts you pointed out... that they gave you a link to the softare, etc. is part of the problem. Sprint doesnt 'officially' support it... and says you can loose your vision for doing it... but unless you abuse it... they look the other way.

My problem with this is that they lock you into a contract, with services that you may or may not be able to use. They cover the business market ok with their per mb connection card plans. They cover the phone only people with unlimited vision, and they cover the very casual phone data user with the 1cent per k you are charged if you dont have a plan.

What they dont cover is users who need unlimited vision, but also need to occasionally use the connection for something more. They handle these folks with their look the other way bs... All ive been saying from the start is sprint needs to get off their Arse and address this... t-mobile for example offers plain and simple to understand data... $20 for all you can eat... on any device.

I would be happy if they would even say $15 unlimited vision on the phone but 1cent per k connected to a notebook or some such. At least then you would know what you were buying... not doing it for 3-4 months without problems then get hit with a few hundred dollar bill and a nasty gram to cut it out or loose your service.

To the poster who mentioned doing everything on a treo. I have a treo 300 and a 600 right now (not sure if the 600 replacing my 300 or not yet, still checking it out) and it can do alot of things but theres a few things it cant do well... SSH/Telnet for one... its possible but the 160x160 display really doesnt work well (really wanted 320x320 in the treo600) and some vendor apps that only come in wintel format. For those you really need a notebook. Ive run some of them in PocketPC under PocketDOS but not a big PPC fan. ;-)

[dstrauss]

Originally posted by alchemist
To the poster who mentioned doing everything on a treo. I have a treo 300 and a 600 right now (not sure if the 600 replacing my 300 or not yet, still checking it out) and it can do alot of things but theres a few things it cant do well... SSH/Telnet for one... its possible but the 160x160 display really doesnt work well (really wanted 320x320 in the treo600) and some vendor apps that only come in wintel format. For those you really need a notebook. Ive run some of them in PocketPC under PocketDOS but not a big PPC fan. ;-)

That was me. Neither a T600 nor the i500 can substitute for the notebook, but they can be a data collecting supplement. At least you can get your email and attachments, work on them on the notebook, and then transfer them back to the phone for transmittal by email. Surfing on that 160x160 screen stinks, but it beats nothing at all. Hopefully, they'll at least do 320x320 in the next go round. In fact, I think the ideal device would be the T600 with a 320x480 T3 type screen, and just the five-way navigator at the bottom. Yes, graffiti is tough to use, but there are lots of good virtual keyboards for extended screens - plus on a usage basis, which gets more use, the screen or the thumb board.

And as for Sprint:

LISTEN TO YOUR USERS - WE NEED A T-MOBILE LIKE DATA PLAN FOR USING THE PHONE AS A DIGITAL MODEM!

[cornbred]

I pay over $115 a month for my two phones with 2500m & unlimited Vision. Frankly I feel entitled to ocassional internet service with my laptop on the road.

I can only assume the reason they have not made the "150-200 megs a month" allowance official is because they don't want to encourage people to use it MORE than they already do. If people knew they OFFICIALLY had 200 megs a month, they'd be on their laptops day and night seeing if they could hit their limit.

Fear keeps them in check.

But I say play their silly game and switch carriers if they try to dump your vision. I'm sure Verizon would love to talk to you.

Corn

[81002004]

klintman, you say that connecting to a "dial up network connection" on a laptop, that it's using a different subsystem (dial tones etc.). Is this the same when using the Sprint Dialer and FutureDial software to connect into Vision #777?

The reason I ask is that there are two ways to connect to a "dial up network" using Sprint. Both require the USB/Phone Cable and both use some sort of dialer/connector. However, one actually dials out to a 3rd party dial up ISP.. and one connects into Vision. Do both of these function the same way? Perhaps when dialing out through Vision, Sprint cannot detect the difference between the phone "dialing out" and the computer dialing out through the phone because of the way the software works? Again, I don't hear the buzzes/beeps when connecting to "Vision" that I do when connecting to a normal "phone-line" 3rd party dial up. So, I figured that meant they were working somewhat differently.

I was just under the impression that the OS/Java Software on the phone mimic'd a "small computer/network-appliance" and plugging it in via a USB cable would theoretically simply pass this connection on to the computer. Now to be compatible with windows it would set up a "dial up networking" interface and did whatever it needed in the USB driver to make things work. Of course being a smart USB/Modem Driver it could also work with 3rd party Dial Ups much in the way that the Old Wireless Web Modem did (with the buzzes and beeps handshaking/negotiation).

With Vision when the laptop made a request it would be passed into the phone and be sent off as though it was the phone's internal browser (or some java application) and thus show up to sprint as the same as if the phone had requested it.

I'm just wondering why that methodology isn't the case or could not be done? Do the Sprint phones prevent this? It seems like you could just write a J2ME application that runs on the phone and acts as as a request/response messenger via the USB Cable to the laptop and sprint would have no idea other than bandwidth. Then if all the can really see is bandwidth, I'm guessing that if I ran constant 24/7 downloads via my phone (not laptop) I'd get the same nasty letter as if I used my laptop.

Any thoughts?

[81002004]

No one commented on my question about whether or not Sprint could really tell the difference between Phone Vision vs. Laptop-connected-to-Phone. If they can... what is the likely hood of writing a java based proxy server application that would make this undetectable? I'd be interested in working on this project if others are.

Also, I still don't see anywhere that it says I can't use my Phone to connect my laptop the internet. I know some of you have pointed out that your contracts state as much. Where would I find such text online? Perhaps this only applies to newer customers who have signed up for the Sprint plans?

thanks

[klintman]

as far as the contract is concerned... sprint reserves the right to change their contract anytime and you have to agree to it. that's how it is with pretty much any contract. and the stuff on vision... it's in there. :-)

i'm probably wrong about sprint being able to verify device type because the towers probably aren't hooked up to the inventory system. a buddy of mine explained that to me later. therefore the towers let phones connect based on esn... but they don't know which esn goes with which device.

and if a phone makes a "real" dial-up connection to a third-party, it should come up as a 2g data charge... which is $0.39 / minute. don't quote me on that. the connection cards connect to a system that simulates a dial-up connection... but it is really connected to the 3g data network (mobile ip).

anyway... this is just getting ridiculous. i can't believe y'all are trying to figure out ways to violate your contracts and screw a company that you claim loyalty to... like it's nothing. y'all should start another site... www.sprintabusers.com. so what if sprint can't detect your laptop or they give you a link to the connection software or whatever.... if it's too much to handle go somewhere else and stop complaining.

you get what you pay for. if you only wanna pay $15 then you only get vision on the phone. and corn... you pay $115 for voice services and vision. that's what you're entitled to my friend. you're not entitled to data access on your laptop because you didn't pay for data access on your laptop.

(sorry in advance if this is offensive... it's just really sad that some people steal stuff everyday and then justify it somehow. it makes me wanna barf.)

[dstrauss]

Originally posted by klintman
you get what you pay for. if you only wanna pay $15 then you only get vision on the phone. and corn... you pay $115 for voice services and vision. that's what you're entitled to my friend. you're not entitled to data access on your laptop because you didn't pay for data access on your laptop.

(sorry in advance if this is offensive... it's just really sad that some people steal stuff everyday and then justify it somehow. it makes me wanna barf.)

klintman: I agree with you 100%. My beef is that Sprint refuses to consider another option - an "up-charge" for all you can eat data through your cell phone to PDA. I can still get that now at $80/month with a business connection and one of their PCMCIA cards, but I don't want another account, nor do I want another PC Card in my notebook with an external antennae to lose/break. I've begged them to let me do the same thing with my i500, but no dice. I'm convinced it's because the CAN track usage through their PCMCIA cards, so everyone else must be illegally connected by cable.

T-Mobile offers unlimited data for $29/month (was $20 a few months ago), and granted, it is much slower GPRS, but still that makes sense for users that need it. The real holdup are the IDIOTS (and I don't care if they do get offended) who try to use Vision as a full time replacement for a broadband ISP and download hundreds of songs and DVD's by the GB.

Vision on my i500 is such a teaser of what it could be to have full time access for browsing, email, and light downloads. As it is, I end up using Snappermail and Docs to Go 6 as a substitute for what could be. Sprint, if you are listening (if you can even hear) start to work on real solutions for reasonable use.

[atyger]

Originally posted by klintman
[B]as far as the contract is concerned... sprint reserves the right to change their contract anytime and you have to agree to it. that's how it is with pretty much any contract. and the stuff on vision... it's in there. :-)

http://sprintpcs.com/common/popups/popLegalTermsPrivacy.html

"We [SPRINT] may change the Agreement at any time by giving you prior notice. Any changes to the Agreement are effective when we publish them. If you use our Services or make any payment to us on or after the effective date of the changes, you accept the changes. If we change a material term of the Agreement and that change has a material adverse effect on you, you may terminate the Agreement without an early termination fee by calling 1-888-211-4727 within 30 days after the invoice date of the first invoice your receive after the changes go into effect."

[atyger]

Originally posted by 81002004

Also, I still don't see anywhere that it says I can't use my Phone to connect my laptop the internet. I know some of you have pointed out that your contracts state as much.

"Unlimited PCS Vision plans/options are only available with phones or PCS smart phones where the device is not being used as a modem in connection with other equipment (e.g., computers, PDAs, etc.) through use of connection kits or other phone-to-computer/PDA accessories, or Bluetooth or other wireless technology. "

Originally posted by 81002004

Where would I find such text online?

http://sprintpcs.com/common/popups/popLegalTermsPrivacy.html



Originally posted by 81002004
Perhaps this only applies to newer customers who have signed up for the Sprint plans?

See previous post.

[81002004]

I do value and respect everyone opinions here, but do need to clarify a few things:

First, we are not all trying to "Abuse" the Sprint network we are loyal too. Anyone here who is using Vision service (on a phone or other device) to specifically, excessively, or unnecessarily use up Vision bandwidth is “abusing” the network. Not everyone is trying to use Vision as a replacement for an ISP. It’s just not all black or white.

Also, regarding this $80 unlimited business plan. What’s to stop them from changing that a month later to say “well Unlimited doesn’t really include laptop/pda use anymore?” You have to remember that some of us were told by several Sprint reps in the store and on the phone that we could in fact use our laptops to connect. In fact the WHOLE point here is just that. We were told something, agreed to it, paid money for it, Sprint changed it midway, and now we feel wronged and confused.

“You get what you pay for”

Again, I agree. When I paid 100’s of dollars for a new phone, equipment, and plan it was under the agreement that I’d be able to use it to connect to my laptop for both Outlook Sync and for Unlimited (but not excessive) use on both the phone AND the laptop. Now they changed all that, and so I didn’t really get what I paid for! I mean if Sprint wants to offer to pay back all the $ lost both in equipment, monthly charges, and pay that nice little number-portability fee for me to move to someone else, just to avoid me checking email every so often no my laptop… then I might feel a bit different. Honestly, I’d still rather stay with Sprint and use the system as they promised.

I mean some of you act as if you’d accept anything Sprint does simply because they claim to have the right to change it. If tomorrow they decided that “Anytime” minutes were no longer valid between 9am and 5pm, would you not feel wronged? All they have to do is put in a little comment in their ToS that “Anytime means anytime except 9am to 5pm,” and you’d accept that? Or what if they said that the Free Nationwide Roaming and Long Distance now only applied to your current State of residence and you’d incur charges for any calls outside your state? Would you accept that? I doubt it and that is the WHOLE point. Our goal is not to weasel around and screw Sprint. Our goals are to 1) understand all the mixed messages that are being presented by Sprint and its representatives and 2) not be abused by Sprint.

Again, all the mixed messages, confusion, and policy clarifications are probably why Sprint is only warning people for excessive use (whether solely on a phone or other device) under the same precedence that almost ANY Unlimited ISP has used to deal with excessive use and abuse of their “unlimited networks.”

The real downside is that these debates keep jumping to extremes instead of looking at fair/reasonable use on BOTH sides. Some people just assume that anyone trying to use their laptop must be some hacker eating up 144kbs 24/7. This is not the case. Sprint should allow those users promised Unlimited Service to have Unlimited use (both in minutes, data, and connectivity) and Users should utilize the system moderately, reasonably, and not excessively. Perhaps Sprint could also look into software to help regulate bandwidth-allotment, etc. I remember when Cable/DSL Companies lowered the bandwidth on uploading to stop people from running excessive uploading and hosting on home computers.

Any comments are welcome… I hope I did not offend anyone here.

[alchemist]

Ah, a voice of reason...

I agree 100% with the previous poster... although it wasnt just in the past that sprint reps told people they could use it with their notebook. I had a sprint rep tell me i could use unlimited vision with my notebook... and pointed me to their website to purchase cables and software. This of course was at a sprint store in St. Louis, this past weekend... so they are still telling people that you can do it... and in my case, used it as a selling point of why to go with sprint over the competition... even going so far as comparing it to the true unlimited data plan offered by t-mobile.

Sprint doesnt even know its own rules.

[klintman]

wow... a salesman lied to you to make a buck. there's a first.

81002004... no offense taken. come on though. what kinda foolishness is that? suggesting sprint would all of a sudden change the offpeak call times or say that laptops couldn't be used in conjunction with data plans. what would you use a data plan for then? silly. you bought your stuff at a radio shack didn't you?

first off... as atyger pointed out... changing the contract in such a way that causes you to loose material would give you the right to leave. but really... those things you suggested have nothing to do with the agreement. those are part of your plan and can't be changed. you have those plan features as long as you're with the company or until you change them.

i don't care if your downloading return of the king (which i highly recommend... only if you've seen the first two of course) or just checking your email once in a while. vision packs aren't designed for this purpose. heck they have included picture mail and download credits. things designed for a phone. abuse (abnormal use) would be considered use that falls outside of the phone.

btw... you do accept anything sprint does with their advantage agreement. even if they change it. you may not like it, but it is legit and you did agree to it. no turning back now baby. suck it up or pay the $150.

so... why do you blame sprint anyway? why not take some responsibility? in the end it was you who signed the paper. in the end all responsibility for understanding that agreement in on your shoulders... not sprint's. sure they want you to understand everything so that they'll have happy customers. because if they fail to keep you happy... then you won't be around for long and neither will they.

capitalism rocks! :-)

[alchemist]

klintman,

All 81002004 was doing with his examples is showing other things sprint could do, which people probably wouldnt stand for...

As for salesman taking advantage, yes thats true, but when they out and out lie and use something as a selling point that the online advantage agreement says is prohibited... thats fraud in my book. Sure the salesman are trying to make a buck, but they are representatives of Sprint Its no different than the salesman selling the plan as having unlimited minutes whenever you want, then getting home and finding out its limited. The salesman committed fraud. Sorry but thats how I see it, and ive talked to alot of sprint stores in the past couple months and almost all of them will tell you about using the phone as a modem, and going to the sprint website to buy cables.

You seemed to think that there was 'no way' sprint would do any of the things 81002004 suggested... but I thought that about their data service as well... I go all the way back to the wireless web days... my qualcomm 2760 which i used with a data cable worked off my minutes... but it died so i bought a new vision phone to replace it... just bought it at compusa, no deals, no contacts or such... then called to activate it... and was told about how i could use unlimited vision for data on my notebook so i switched my $10 a month wireless web to the $10 a month unlimited vision. At no time did i voice sign a contract or anything, no new terms were presented to me, only that vision was there high speed replacement for wireless web and i could use it on an unlimited basis for phone or notebook use. Then a few months later I read somewhere about unlimited not being unlimited and started to look into the issue... basically sprint transferred me from a service i could use with a notebook, to one that i cant... all the while telling me that I could.

According to sprints policies they can change their advantage agreement anytime they want and you have to live with it... there are a few things that are contract based (minutes, long distance, etc) but all those things could be limited by changing the advantage agreement... for example you have unlimited offpeak, and free nationwide longdistance... but they could change the agreement that longdistance only works with anytime minutes.... so making a long distance call off peak would cost you minutes.

[Mad Dogg]

so what exactly do you need to set up a connect with your phone? Sorry, im behind the game abit!

[dhiles]

I just got a Treo 600 and prior to that had a 300. I have snappermail and a bunch of other internet apps. I make extensive use of vision on a regular basis. In fact a tech asked me once about my vision usage. I told him that I used the internet a lot, but the agreement did say unlimited. He suggested that I must be connecting it to a computer to get that much usage. I told him that I did not know you could even do that with these phones which was true at that time. He explained that it was against the rules. I told him I had DSL at home but I just used vision a lot on the handheld. He seemed satisfied with that. It was all true. I had never used a cable with it. I must be jumping up and down on the line as it is.

[Suliman]

Can anyone guesstimate how may hours of internet access time equates to 150 Meg of data, which seems to be the figure to stay under if using Vision to access the internet through a PC. Five hours, fifty hours, 100 hours? Not talking about downloading picture and songs, just surfing some websites like this one, checking Yahoo email, online shopping, etc. I was wondering if I could use this method sparingly or even replace my cheapo ISP provider I use now.

Suliman

[Matthew99]

They have another problem that I haven't seen mentioned. The below is from SprintPCS.com website "Help Center" > "Find Answers" > "User Guides & Tutorials". I came across it on 23 Aug 03 and saved a copy. I don't know how long it was up and has since been taken down. Google has it cached. But it pretty well sets them up for accusations of "bait & switch".

--------------------------------------------------

What is PCS Wireless Web Connection?
PCS Wireless Web Connection allows you to use your PCS Phone in place of a computer modem. Whatever you've done before by connecting via a telephone wall jack, you can now do with your PCS Phone and a PCS Connection Kit. With PCS Wireless Web Connection, your computer connects over the Sprint Nationwide PCS Network, giving you the freedom to access information when and where you choose. With PCS Wireless Web Connection, you can do the following:

* Access the World Wide Web through your regular Internet service provider and Web browser.
* Use your regular email server or Web-based email.
* Synchronize all your schedules and contact lists while away from the office.
(PCS Wireless Web is not available while roaming and in certain areas managed by affiliates.)

[Matthew99]

They have another problem that I haven't seen mentioned. The below is from SprintPCS.com website "Help Center" > "Find Answers" > "User Guides & Tutorials". I came across it on 23 Aug 03 and saved a copy. I don't know how long it was up and has since been taken down. Google has it cached. But it pretty well sets them up for accusations of "bait & switch".

--------------------------------------------------

What is PCS Wireless Web Connection?
PCS Wireless Web Connection allows you to use your PCS Phone in place of a computer modem. Whatever you've done before by connecting via a telephone wall jack, you can now do with your PCS Phone and a PCS Connection Kit. With PCS Wireless Web Connection, your computer connects over the Sprint Nationwide PCS Network, giving you the freedom to access information when and where you choose. With PCS Wireless Web Connection, you can do the following:

* Access the World Wide Web through your regular Internet service provider and Web browser.
* Use your regular email server or Web-based email.
* Synchronize all your schedules and contact lists while away from the office.
(PCS Wireless Web is not available while roaming and in certain areas managed by affiliates.)

[Matthew99]

They have another problem that I haven't seen mentioned. The below is from SprintPCS.com website "Help Center" > "Find Answers" > "User Guides & Tutorials". I came across it on 23 Aug 03 and saved a copy. I don't know how long it was up and has since been taken down. Google has it cached. But it pretty well sets them up for accusations of "bait & switch".

One other thing. The 'latency' that keeps getting mentioned is isn't latency at all, but a deeply, profoundly overwhelmed proxy server. Consider: when it takes many long minutes for a web page to start loading, and then loads quickly, yet sprintpcs.com loads promptly, even while waiting for another page to start, what does that imply?

My suspicion is that Sprint's network isn't designed & run by IT professionals but rather, what some might call "advanced hobbyists'.


--------------------------------------------------
from the sprintpcs.com website
--------------------------------------------------

What is PCS Wireless Web Connection?
PCS Wireless Web Connection allows you to use your PCS Phone in place of a computer modem. Whatever you've done before by connecting via a telephone wall jack, you can now do with your PCS Phone and a PCS Connection Kit. With PCS Wireless Web Connection, your computer connects over the Sprint Nationwide PCS Network, giving you the freedom to access information when and where you choose. With PCS Wireless Web Connection, you can do the following:

* Access the World Wide Web through your regular Internet service provider and Web browser.
* Use your regular email server or Web-based email.
* Synchronize all your schedules and contact lists while away from the office.
(PCS Wireless Web is not available while roaming and in certain areas managed by affiliates.)

[atyger]

Originally posted by Matthew99
... But it pretty well sets them up for accusations of "bait & switch".

you'll have no ground to stand on.


From the current tos:

"We [Sprint] may change the Agreement at any time by giving you prior notice. Any changes to the Agreement are effective when we publish them. If you use our Services or make any payment to us on or after the effective date of the changes, you accept the changes."


you did pay your bill? didn't you?

[dstrauss]

Originally posted by Matthew99
What is PCS Wireless Web Connection?

Nice try, but no cigar. "PCS Wireless Web" was the predecessor to Vision, and it used your pool of minutes for data connections. I'm sure they'd love for you to go back and burn up your 300 minutes per month on that.

[rberkey]

I work in the lab at supplynet where we manufacture data cables for PDA's and laptops for use on the Vision network. So our data volume is quite high. We have no problem.

[john1936]

dstrauss is of course right. I still use "Wireless Web" for the $5 per month plus minutes charged. I just use it night and weekends - free minutes. And don't get in a hurry!

[dbldwn02]

Why? Why? Why? Why can't I use the internet on my laptop say when I go on a road trip and get lost and want to find directions really quick and easy. Come on. Stopping at the gas station and asking for directions is very unreliable and a thing of the past. Get with the times Sprint! I don't use my laptop to download any media (mp3,mpeg,etc) Why can't I use it to download a MAP. Just a MAP! Maybe just 4 or 5 times a month. What's the big deal? Tell me 10 MB/month will tie up your precious towers.

[parrott84]

This may be a dumb question, but lets say you had the old wireless web and then bought a new phone and cable and continued to surf the internet with the new phone and cable, would it still be wireless web or would they now charge you for vision service? Because if you could keep the wireless web but use a 3g phone there wouldn't be an arguement would there? Just wondering. Thanks.

[Maokh]

Why? Why? Why? Why can't I use the internet on my laptop say when I go on a road trip and get lost and want to find directions really quick and easy. Come on. Stopping at the gas station and asking for directions is very unreliable and a thing of the past. Get with the times Sprint! I don't use my laptop to download any media (mp3,mpeg,etc) Why can't I use it to download a MAP. Just a MAP! Maybe just 4 or 5 times a month. What's the big deal? Tell me 10 MB/month will tie up your precious towers.

For casual laptop usage, it wont hurt anything. There is a glut of capacity...but if everyone went crazy with their $15 IDSL line-in-your-pocket, that may not be the case. This would disrupt service offerings such as readylink or the *real* streaming video handset apps coming this fall/winter.

[sheureka]

This may be a dumb question, but lets say you had the old wireless web and then bought a new phone and cable and continued to surf the internet with the new phone and cable, would it still be wireless web or would they now charge you for vision service? Because if you could keep the wireless web but use a 3g phone there wouldn't be an arguement would there? Just wondering. Thanks.You can't keep 2G wireless web service if you have a 3G phone. - sheureka

[81002004]

Matthew99 you bring up an interesting point with the PCS Wireless Web Connection.

While dstrauss is right about the Wireless Web Connection, Sprint has new software (aka the Sprint Dialer) that is still available on their site and in fact "pushed" at the customer with phones that are not even remotely related to their $80+ business plans. For example, on my phone the Sanyo 8100, when I sign into the sprint site, I have a "download software for use with yoru phone" section that allows me to download a program for Win/2k called the Sprint Dialer. This dialer is a Sprint program who's only obvious purpose is for me to connect my laptop to the internet using Sprint Vision. It's very similar to the dialer offered by FutureDial.

So again... if it's not allowed.. then why do they a) tell me it's allowed and b) blatantly give me software who's sole purpose is to do use my laptop on vision and c) provide tech support on how to do do this.

However, this discussion is quickly become moot point because it seems as though Sprint has started to listen to it's customers. New vision packages offer the Business Connection Plan which states:

---
PCS Business ConnectionSM Personal Edition is available for a minimal monthly charge. It gives you secure, remote, real-time access to Microsoft® Outlook® or Lotus Notes® information — including email, calendars, business directories and personal contacts — from any WAP-enabled PCS Phone, Palm Powered® and Windows Powered PCS Phone, PDA or PC with Internet access
---

From what I've been told by Spring - old Unlimited $10/month accounts are grandfathered in with this services (as well as PictureMail and other sprint vision services that are now broken up into 3 packages)

Let's hope this kind of stuff continues.

[dstrauss]

...PCS Business ConnectionSM Personal Edition is available for a minimal monthly charge. It gives you secure, remote, real-time access to Microsoft® Outlook® or Lotus Notes® information — including email, calendars, business directories and personal contacts — from any WAP-enabled PCS Phone, Palm Powered® and Windows Powered PCS Phone, PDA or PC with Internet access
---

From what I've been told by Spring - old Unlimited $10/month accounts are grandfathered in with this services (as well as PictureMail and other sprint vision services that are now broken up into 3 packages)

Let's hope this kind of stuff continues.

PCS Business Connection is not a general Web access service, but an Outlook and Notes connector to keep your phone in sync with your email and folders on your Outlook/Notes server. You are not getting an Internet connection per se, even if they are using their data service to make the connection. As for the Sprint dialer, that does get you a Web connection, but their terms of service still prohibit connections. Stupid, yes. Vintage Sprint, yes. Do all the sale people push the phones saying you can connect to the net with your notebook - very often yes. Do they still crack down on users doing so - the Internet is full of folks who claim they've been tagged by the Sprint Internet police.

There is still no comparable plan for web access with your phone, through your notebook, to the PC Connection cards. That's another reason Sprint kills all attempts at CDMA bluetooth phones - too easy to connect to your notebook or high end PDA. :furious:

[im_greg_p]

I think that they should offer like 200 megs free for PC connections and then once they get their new networks increase it.

[signel]

from a tracking standpoint, it is very easy to monitor a connection. I can tell how fast/much I am using from my laptop, so I'd find it hard to believe sprint can't tell from their end. The question is, does sprint want to waste resources tracking 1% of their cleints base? I doubt its worth the time/effort unless that client is abusing the system.

[mrbueler]

Here I am looking to shed myself of my home DSL (too addictive) with the idea of adding service to my Sprint plan so that I can surf here and there. But, it sounds to be more complicated...

A half hour ago I spoke with a rep that was confused about what I was wanting to do. The answer was eventually that I would pay $15 plus $.01 per KB, which means BLAH to me.

What I really want to do is to upgrade to a plan where I can make use of my phone (looking at Treo 600 or 610) as e-mail gizzmo or hook up to my laptop when needed.

Is there a better option?

Damien

[clairegrrl]

I have read everything here, and I still cant figure out if I can use my Treo600 and my laptop every once in a while. Has anybody really ever been canceled?? :confused:

[81002004]

from a tracking standpoint, it is very easy to monitor a connection. I can tell how fast/much I am using from my laptop, so I'd find it hard to believe sprint can't tell from their end. The question is, does sprint want to waste resources tracking 1% of their cleints base? I doubt its worth the time/effort unless that client is abusing the system.

They are definitely tracking bandwidth. The only question that's been debated for a couple years is can they tell the difference between the phone/smart-phone using the web and a laptop-connected-to-the-phone-via-a-cable using the web.

It's likely that they can't tell the difference - othereise they could just blcok all laptop-2-phone-#777 connections. In other word, they would either block this for everyone from the get go or block it for those using too much bandwitdh instead of just cutting their service (i.e. Why would they want to "cut" customers if they can sovle the problem by blocking)

mrbueler, Using Sprint as an ISP for a laptop/computer for daily/weekly use will likely cause a red flag in the system. If you've been a customer for 10 years.. they might overlook this. If you signed up a few months ago, they might cut you, or you might be overlooked.

[Maokh]

If you really need data on the go, purchase a connection card.

I am a lot happier doing this than connecting up my cell phone via USB, missing calls, and suffering from poor battery life during data transfers. Not to mention the issues of the DTE/DCE at 115kbps and causing tons of errors and buffer overflows.

[Zyrix]

[QUOTE=81002004]It's likely that they can't tell the difference - othereise they could just blcok all laptop-2-phone-#777 connections. In other word, they would either block this for everyone from the get go or block it for those using too much bandwitdh instead of just cutting their service (i.e. Why would they want to "cut" customers if they can sovle the problem by blocking)
QUOTE]

If they can't tell then #777 is the same connection as WAP the phone uses and unchangeable, if they can tell then they either don't care if its under 150megs or its still in development. Thats my take atleast

[ivanross]

All,

Ive been a sprint customer since WAY back... my first sprint phone was a Qualcomm 2760 that I used with a digital phone card to connect to my notebook or my hp jornada 545 handheld.

I payed $10 a month for 'Wireless Web' which gave me VERY PRIMATIVE web browsing on the phone, and the ability to connect with a computer at the amazing max speed of 14.4k. usually much slower.

Then came sprint PCS Vision... which muddies the waters for me. You can get unlimited vision for $15 (was $10 when i got it, but now they charge $15 and tack on $5 credit toward services you wont use) with speeds up to 144k.

I see here on these forums that alot of people seem to connect their phones to their notebooks... has anyone got a nastygram from Sprint about their vision usage?

Sprints answer seems to be, offer unlimited but dont offer any connection kits and definitely (no matter how much misdirection we need to employ) release any bluetooth phones. Im thinking the real problem might be that Sprint can't meter their bandwidth usage... so in reality have no idea how much any given vision user uses... would explain a bit about their model.



NEVER got a nastygram. Use it all the time.

[chocbar31]

YEAH, me too! No nasty grams...

Ok, maybe from Comcast for using multiple IP addys and only paying for one...LOL!!! (They never changed it either...hehehehe) Gave me three months before they would block the addresses.

Woops...different forum info

[jeffkl]

I think the problem lies in the fact that Sprint has no option for the casual user -- the person who has DSL at home and/or office but wants to get email for a couple of minutes a day or a few times a year on vacation when away from the office. I believe Sprint has done a great job with their unlimited Vision pack and a reasonable job offering data packs for heavy users, but nothing for us in this middle category. Their answer may be to "look the other way" for the casual user since it may be too hard for them to determine where to draw the line. I think if you have a good customer who casually uses data network they will probably not want to risk losing a customer over a few megabytes of data a month, especially as more companies add 3G service. However, if a person sucks up the network the cost-benefit ration of wanting to keep a customer goes down. I think I read on one forum that someone was using their Sprint Vision phone exclusively as their ISP and accumulated GIGABYTES of download usage. That ties it up for all of us.

It's a tough call and it would behoove Sprint to develop a middle ground for casual users.

[jeffkl]

One more question, actually -- what about Smart Phone users? If they have Sprint Vision on their smart phone/PDA, are they limited by the amount of data they can access? It seems to me that they may be able to download gigabytes of data because they are not using their phone in a way it was not specifically designed to be used, am I correct?

[jander]

I think the problem lies in the fact that Sprint has no option for the casual user -- the person who has DSL at home and/or office but wants to get email for a couple of minutes a day or a few times a year on vacation when away from the office. I believe Sprint has done a great job with their unlimited Vision pack and a reasonable job offering data packs for heavy users, but nothing for us in this middle category. Their answer may be to "look the other way" for the casual user since it may be too hard for them to determine where to draw the line. I think if you have a good customer who casually uses data network they will probably not want to risk losing a customer over a few megabytes of data a month, especially as more companies add 3G service. However, if a person sucks up the network the cost-benefit ration of wanting to keep a customer goes down. I think I read on one forum that someone was using their Sprint Vision phone exclusively as their ISP and accumulated GIGABYTES of download usage. That ties it up for all of us.

It's a tough call and it would behoove Sprint to develop a middle ground for casual users.

I would love to see something as well, as I really don't have a need often enough to justify $80/mo or whatever it is for a connection card. Before people start screaming to not use it then, I would like to say that I do not use my phone as a modem (although I did with my old 2G phone since that was legal). I would just like to see if there was some smaller data plan to allow people to use the phone as a modem. Since I really don't use it much anyways I would not mind even if it were a connection like the old Wireless Web 2G days (yeah, the speed were so bad...but would be nice to be able to use something).

[warder]

I personally think it has to do with where you live... IF theres lots of people its really congested, but if theres not more is ok?

[jgill81]

wow... a salesman lied to you to make a buck. there's a first.

81002004... no offense taken. come on though. what kinda foolishness is that? suggesting sprint would all of a sudden change the offpeak call times or say that laptops couldn't be used in conjunction with data plans. what would you use a data plan for then? silly. you bought your stuff at a radio shack didn't you?

first off... as atyger pointed out... changing the contract in such a way that causes you to loose material would give you the right to leave. but really... those things you suggested have nothing to do with the agreement. those are part of your plan and can't be changed. you have those plan features as long as you're with the company or until you change them.

i don't care if your downloading return of the king (which i highly recommend... only if you've seen the first two of course) or just checking your email once in a while. vision packs aren't designed for this purpose. heck they have included picture mail and download credits. things designed for a phone. abuse (abnormal use) would be considered use that falls outside of the phone.

btw... you do accept anything sprint does with their advantage agreement. even if they change it. you may not like it, but it is legit and you did agree to it. no turning back now baby. suck it up or pay the $150.

so... why do you blame sprint anyway? why not take some responsibility? in the end it was you who signed the paper. in the end all responsibility for understanding that agreement in on your shoulders... not sprint's. sure they want you to understand everything so that they'll have happy customers. because if they fail to keep you happy... then you won't be around for long and neither will they.

capitalism rocks! :-)


Dude you are a real idiot if you think that there are no salesman that scam people into buying something to make a buck. Where are you from West Virginia or something where everyone sleeps with there brothers and sisters? If you don't like any of the posts why are you on this website? Damn get a brain moron.

[john1936]

Does this seem to you as though Sprint PCS is somewhat clearing the muddy water?? Or is it my wishful thinking?


http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/wlg/5791

http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/wlg/5825

"""I also asked whether the commentator on my previous post was right about the terms of service being a concern, and Jeff(Shafer) responded, "my understanding is that no, we do not have a restriction on these devices from a pricing/plan standpoint. This sort of use only represents a pretty small fraction of Sprint Vision customers, so we see it as one of those areas where if this is how customers choose to connect, we don't stand in the way."""

[BlueFlame]

Okay,

I has also been a sprint customer for a looooong time. My first phone was the first Samsung flip...that silver one that the ear peice always broke on.

Well what I did to get unlimited vision use was to get a wireless connection card....find a store representative that is friendly and tell them you want to ad a line to your current plan...they will ask you if you want to share minutes, and then will charge you an extra 10 for vision on the phone....but you will now have unlimited vision for 30 bucks a month....


All,

Ive been a sprint customer since WAY back... my first sprint phone was a Qualcomm 2760 that I used with a digital phone card to connect to my notebook or my hp jornada 545 handheld.

I payed $10 a month for 'Wireless Web' which gave me VERY PRIMATIVE web browsing on the phone, and the ability to connect with a computer at the amazing max speed of 14.4k. usually much slower.

Then came sprint PCS Vision... which muddies the waters for me. You can get unlimited vision for $15 (was $10 when i got it, but now they charge $15 and tack on $5 credit toward services you wont use) with speeds up to 144k.

Heres my problem. I use my phone about 90% of the time by itself, but occasionally want to hook it up to my laptop when out of town. I could do this without problems on the old wireless web, but now sprint 'threatens' that you cant use your unlimited vision for a laptop... instead you need to spend up to $100 a month for a per megabyte plan that i wont use 9 months out of the year.

I see here on these forums that alot of people seem to connect their phones to their notebooks... has anyone got a nastygram from Sprint about their vision usage?

Overall im happy with sprints coverage... and havent had to deal with their CS people much... but have thought about moving to TMobile because of this issue... at least their plan is a flat $19.95 for unlimited use for whatever you want service.

Sprints answer seems to be, offer unlimited but dont offer any connection kits and definitely (no matter how much misdirection we need to employ) release any bluetooth phones. Im thinking the real problem might be that Sprint can't meter their bandwidth usage... so in reality have no idea how much any given vision user uses... would explain a bit about their model.

Well, enough of my jumping around... anyone have any enlightenment about using vision with a notebook or palm, without getting the sprint police after you? I also need to move to a family plan with multiple phones soon and that will require a contract so trying to figure out where to go when that happens.

Thanks in advance.

[qbc]

just buy a data card :huh:

[SyntheticXtasy]

I have had my samsung a660 for well over seven months now.

I work twelve hours a day, five days a week. During that 60 hour period, I am generally online via my cell phone and data cable connected to my laptop. I download anywhere from 5MB to 500MB of data a day. I havent recieved any notice or anything from sprint, and I haven't gotten charged for extra services.

Just my experience.

[Karkass]

me too, ive used 950 mb, in 3 months...though ive been getting alot of network busy please try again,

[3G Cables]

I have had my samsung a660 for well over seven months now.

I work twelve hours a day, five days a week. During that 60 hour period, I am generally online via my cell phone and data cable connected to my laptop. I download anywhere from 5MB to 500MB of data a day. I havent recieved any notice or anything from sprint, and I haven't gotten charged for extra services.

Just my experience.

It usually takes 3 months for them to flag you. For sure you will get flagged, it is just a matter of time. It might take more than 3 months but that kind of usage for sure gets noticed.

Oh, and when you are flagged with that kind of usage your Vision is stopped immediately and you need to pay back usage, if you don’t you will get terminated on all your lines. Please realize this only happens in extreme cases like yours.

[sheureka]

Oh, and when you are flagged with that kind of usage your Vision is stopped immediately and you need to pay back usage, if you don’t you will get terminated on all your lines.In the 2 years I have been following this forum and this issue, I have NEVER seen a reliable, verified account that this happened. - sheureka

[3G Cables]

In the 2 years I have been following this forum and this issue, I have NEVER seen a reliable, verified account that this happened. - sheureka

COOL! Everyone, sheureka just stated that no one has EVER been flagged for Vision over-usage. This means that it appears that we can now use UNLIMITED and in the above case about 500MB’s of data per day!

Wow, this is really great news!

[john1936]

This is what really has me confused; one states that if you use X amount of Vision on your computer you will be flagged, your vision will be turned off and you will billed for past usage and another states that is not so??? Somebody give me a clue as to what to believe - as you can't tell I don't have one (a clue that is). :confused:

[sheureka]

This is what really has me confused; one states that if you use X amount of Vision on your computer you will be flagged, your vision will be turned off and you will billed for past usage and another states that is not so??? Somebody give me a clue as to what to believe - as you can't tell I don't have one (a clue that is). :confused:
I did not say it has never happened. I said I have never seen any verified report of it happening, either on this forum or on HoFo. If 3G has documents to show the past-usage billing and Vision being turned off then he should show us all. - sheureka

[3G Cables]

I did not say it has never happened. I said I have never seen any verified report of it happening, either on this forum or on HoFo. If 3G has documents to show the past-usage billing and Vision being turned off then he should show us all. - sheureka

I was being sarcastic if you guys couldn’t tell =) I use to work for Sprint. I know from being told internally that data usage is monitored and people are shut off. The “unofficial” threshold I heard through the grapevine was 1GB per month. I believe this to be true but I don’t know for a fact. I have read on this forum of someone being shut off and had to pay for back usage. I don’t know which thread it was but I think I read it about 2 months ago. It does happen and it is documented. The fact is most people don’t push it so it is hard to find someone that is shut off.

If you were told that you would lose your car for good if you were speeding regularly at 150 MPH would you do it even if your car could go that fast? I don’t think so but some people would.

[SyntheticXtasy]

3G Cables, you seem to be sending very mixed messages to me and others...

This is quoted from 3g cables' post in another thread here:
http://www.sprintusers.com/forum/showthread.php?t=53138

I agree with you 100% on Sprints lack of an unlimited data plan. I think it is ridiculous. However, I have used an easy 500MB’s per month with the cable and never been shut off. I use to work for Sprint and the unofficial limit I heard floating around was 1 GB which is plenty for occasional use.

Keep the data cable, it is the best deal with the fastest speeds. I have used the GPRS network, MUCH MUCH slower and not worth it.

Wait till EV-DO is released for Sprint in January! That will be the best way to go by far as long as the pricing is right.


Read the original thread for the question asked...

[3G Cables]

3G Cables, you seem to be sending very mixed messages to me and others...

This is quoted from 3g cables' post in another thread here:
http://www.sprintusers.com/forum/showthread.php?t=53138



Read the original thread for the question asked...

I have learned that I can’t be sarcastic here. People take things too seriously. Sorry, it won’t happen again.

[cinnamngrl]

I honestly dont know if they can track bandwidth now or not. All ive been able to confirm recently is that using the phone as a modem comes in on a different port so they can tell when you aer doing that versus using the phone alone.

When vision originally launched though, it was a few months late and they were pressed to get it out the door. They went to unlimited vision at the last minute... before that it was going to be metered by bandwidth. I talked to a sprint tech about it and was told they didnt have bandwidth metering setup so went unlimited so they could launch without it. they might have it by now for all I know.

How did you confirm that it was a different port? When I look at my data settings through ##3282# (spell data), the primary gateway says port 80 whether I go on through the phone or through the palm. :confused:

[jkayxxx1]

Did someone say that if I use my phone and cable to dial into my isp, I will incur charges ? What if I use the 777, but don't download?

[sheureka]

Did someone say that if I use my phone and cable to dial into my isp, I will incur charges ? What if I use the 777, but don't download?
You probably won't be able to dial into your ISP (without doing some serious hacks on your phone) but if you do manage to do it, it's 37 (39?) cents a minute and uses your minutes. As long as you have Vision enabled, dialing into Sprint (#777) doesn't cost you anything and doesn't use your minutes. Just don't go nuts and start running a server or downloading movies or something. - sheureka :p

[jkayxxx1]

You probably won't be able to dial into your ISP (without doing some serious hacks on your phone) but if you do manage to do it, it's 37 (39?) cents a minute and uses your minutes. As long as you have Vision enabled, dialing into Sprint (#777) doesn't cost you anything and doesn't use your minutes. Just don't go nuts and start running a server or downloading movies or something. - sheureka :p

I was able to dial into my ISP, but at 39 cents a minute.. I don't have the PCS Vision service, so it is going to cost either way. Verizon doesn't charge you. I am sorry that I am locked into Sprint.

[3G Cables]

I was able to dial into my ISP, but at 39 cents a minute.. I don't have the PCS Vision service, so it is going to cost either way. Verizon doesn't charge you. I am sorry that I am locked into Sprint.

Verizon does not give it for free. It is the exact same situation with Sprint.

Verizon’s Network

There are three types of networks for Verizon.

Quick 2 Net – Speeds up to 14.4k/sec you will be charged for airtime minutes used but not data usage.

National Access – You need to purchase this. Speeds up to 144k/sec you will not be charged for airtime minutes and you will only be charged for data usage if you go over the MB’s that are in your National Access Plan. If you don’t know how many MB’s you have in your National Access Plan you need to contact Verizon. You will be charge $8 per Megabyte usage over your plan usage.

EV-DO Network – Speeds from 300-500ksec with bursts up to 2Mb’s per second. Only supported by a PC data card model number 5220 and unlimited data usage rate is $79.99 per month. Only supported in certain major cities at this point check with Verizon to see which cities are covered.

** These quotes were accurate at the time of writing and may differ at your location and time you signed your plan..

[jkayxxx1]

Verizon does not give it for free. It is the exact same situation with Sprint.

Verizon’s Network

There are three types of networks for Verizon.

Quick 2 Net – Speeds up to 14.4k/sec you will be charged for airtime minutes used but not data usage.

National Access – You need to purchase this. Speeds up to 144k/sec you will not be charged for airtime minutes and you will only be charged for data usage if you go over the MB’s that are in your National Access Plan. If you don’t know how many MB’s you have in your National Access Plan you need to contact Verizon. You will be charge $8 per Megabyte usage over your plan usage.

EV-DO Network – Speeds from 300-500ksec with bursts up to 2Mb’s per second. Only supported by a PC data card model number 5220 and unlimited data usage rate is $79.99 per month. Only supported in certain major cities at this point check with Verizon to see which cities are covered.

** These quotes were accurate at the time of writing and may differ at your location and time you signed your plan..


Yes, I was referring to quick 2 net. We use it for work. Does sprint have anything comparable ? I don't mind using minutes but don't want to pay an additional 39 cents per minute. I don't plan to download. I just want to have it in case I need to connect while I am mobile.

[3G Cables]

Yes, I was referring to quick 2 net. We use it for work. Does sprint have anything comparable ? I don't mind using minutes but don't want to pay an additional 39 cents per minute. I don't plan to download. I just want to have it in case I need to connect while I am mobile.

I see. You can actually live with those slow speeds?

Sprint does not have a similar service. They used to "Wireless Web" but they got rid of the free Wireless Web when they introduced Vision.

In my opinion $15 per month for Vision with speeds 5 times faster than Quick-2-Net, MUCH better.

[Nick702]

I have never been concerned with them giving me a hard time on data usage, I have downloaded movies, songs, even the XP SP 2 using my laptop with a data cable and #777. They have never said a word. My phone shows that I have used 829MB in the lifetime, and I just got this particular phone about 3 months ago. However, I travel constantly, and am rarely pulling data from the same towers from one day to the next.

Nick

[dstrauss]

I have never been concerned with them giving me a hard time on data usage, I have downloaded movies, songs, even the XP SP 2 using my laptop with a data cable and #777. They have never said a word. My phone shows that I have used 829MB in the lifetime, and I just got this particular phone about 3 months ago. However, I travel constantly, and am rarely pulling data from the same towers from one day to the next.

Nick

Soapbox time:

Vision was never meant for this kind of abuse. It is better than dial up, but not intended as a replacement for a broadband connection (downloading XP SP2 - GET REAL). It's this kind of behavior (and attitude) that's going to stick a fork in unlimited Vision for the rest of us. :furious:

[3G Cables]

Soapbox time:

Vision was never meant for this kind of abuse. It is better than dial up, but not intended as a replacement for a broadband connection (downloading XP SP2 - GET REAL). It's this kind of behavior (and attitude) that's going to stick a fork in unlimited Vision for the rest of us. :furious:

I couldnt agree more with you!

[Richard257]

I also agree, MODERATE use please. Richard

[jkayxxx1]

If you don't have Vision in your plan and you use #777 do you get charged by the minute ?

[3G Cables]

If you don't have Vision in your plan and you use #777 do you get charged by the minute ?

If you dont have Vision on your plan, dialing #777 will do nothing so you wont get on the web and you wont be charged.

[jkayxxx1]

If you dont have Vision on your plan, dialing #777 will do nothing so you wont get on the web and you wont be charged.

I don't pay for Vision but I can access the web. I can also connect using #777. I just tried.
I cancelled my service about a week ago and got the cancellation notice, but maybe they haven't actually cancelled my service yet.

[john1936]

I don't pay for Vision but I can access the web. I can also connect using #777. I just tried.
I cancelled my service about a week ago and got the cancellation notice, but maybe they haven't actually cancelled my service yet.

I believe you are charged per kb... Could become an expensive trial.

[sheureka]

If you dont have Vision on your plan, dialing #777 will do nothing so you wont get on the web and you wont be charged.

:huh: If you don't have a Vision plan (and have a Vision phone) you can still use Vision on your phone or hooked up to a laptop. But you're going to be charged $0.01 per kb, and that can add up really fast, so be careful. - sheureka

[MickCole]

Soapbox time:

Vision was never meant for this kind of abuse. It is better than dial up, but not intended as a replacement for a broadband connection (downloading XP SP2 - GET REAL). It's this kind of behavior (and attitude) that's going to stick a fork in unlimited Vision for the rest of us. :furious:
With all due respect, I most humbly disagree. Doesn't seem like abuse to me at all. Broadband is fine at home, but when you're away from home, Vision seems like the way to go.
It's easy to download 100 MB a day if you use a device like the PPC6600/6601 for streaming audio, which according to an email I received from customer ecare is OK within the TOS and not a problem at all. Which means I could easily stream a gig or two a month and Sprint would be perfectly fine with it.
The consensus here and elsewhere is that 300MB/month tethered will usually escape the notice of Sprint's TOS police, and is perfectly OK. However, technically any amount of tethered is a violation of the TOS, and may result in the loss of Vision, at the discretion of Sprint. In addition, any amount to the device is OK.
YMMV,
Mick

[3G Cables]

With all due respect, I most humbly disagree. Doesn't seem like abuse to me at all. Broadband is fine at home, but when you're away from home, Vision seems like the way to go.
It's easy to download 100 MB a day if you use a device like the PPC6600/6601 for streaming audio, which according to an email I received from customer ecare is OK within the TOS and not a problem at all. Which means I could easily stream a gig or two a month and Sprint would be perfectly fine with it.
The consensus here and elsewhere is that 300MB/month tethered will usually escape the notice of Sprint's TOS police, and is perfectly OK. However, technically any amount of tethered is a violation of the TOS, and may result in the loss of Vision, at the discretion of Sprint. In addition, any amount to the device is OK.
YMMV,
Mick

Mike feel free to stream audio all day and let us know how many days until you get shut off.

[sheureka]

Mike feel free to stream audio all day and let us know how many days until you get shut off.No way he'll get shut down for streaming audio to his phone. - sheureka

[3G Cables]

No way he'll get shut down for streaming audio to his phone. - sheureka

I know that but he doesnt seem to think so.

[Azady]

Hi, I connect to laptop with sanyo 8100, I have a problem after 5 to 10 mints I get time out or can not connect to website, even though I am still connected. Thanks.

[3G Cables]

Hi, I connect to laptop with sanyo 8100, I have a problem after 5 to 10 mints I get time out or can not connect to website, even though I am still connected. Thanks.

You need to make a bat file that will ping the connection. It has been discussed here many times.

[Azady]

Thanks for info would you please direct me to the location I have not able to find it.

[3G Cables]

Thanks for info would you please direct me to the location I have not able to find it.

The search button in the upper right hand of every page here. I just did a search and found it seconds later http://www.sprintusers.com/forum/showthread.php?t=51151&highlight=bat+file

[Azady]

Thanks You.

[Azady]

Hi, could anyone tells me how to make a bat file in winxp that pings. Thanks.

[clindner]

Hi, could anyone tells me how to make a bat file in winxp that pings. Thanks.

Click on Start, then All Programs, then Accessories, then Command Prompt.

Type "ping -t www.yahoo.com"

Start your Vision DUN connection.

If the ping is responding with "Reply from...." you are connected. If this drops off, and you get "Request timed out" over and over, you need to disconnect and reconnect.

The Sanyo phones are all pretty bad for these connections. Other phones, at least the ones I've used, don't do this.

Good luck!

-Curt

[Jer1]

No way he'll get shut down for streaming audio to his phone. - sheureka

I'd *REALLY* like to se in the TOS where ti says I cant stream audio/video allllll day long if I want to..........
I pay my bill I like to get what I pay for

I dont 'abuse it'

I just use it the way I see is inside the TOS and is USEFUL to me.

my 2 cents
Jer1

[3G Cables]

I'd *REALLY* like to se in the TOS where ti says I cant stream audio/video allllll day long if I want to..........
I pay my bill I like to get what I pay for

I dont 'abuse it'

I just use it the way I see is inside the TOS and is USEFUL to me.

my 2 cents
Jer1

You can stream audio and video all day if you want on your HANDSET. You may not realize the massive compression they are using when you view or hear it on your handset. Even if you streamed all day on your handset it would not even come close to streaming audio/video or even heavy web and email usage on your PC. Not even close.

That is the difference.

my 4 cents

[Jer1]

You can stream audio and video all day if you want on your HANDSET. You may not realize the massive compression they are using when you view or hear it on your handset. Even if you streamed all day on your handset it would not even come close to streaming audio/video or even heavy web and email usage on your PC. Not even close.

That is the difference.

my 4 cents

check this
I streamed an AVI file to my handset using MMplayer on my treo
and then from my laptop using windows media player...same file...
........
the same amount of data transfer occured for both acording to ##786
and my webserver

Thoughts??


my nickel's worth :)
Jer1

[3G Cables]

check this
I streamed an AVI file to my handset using MMplayer on my treo
and then from my laptop using windows media player...same file...
........
the same amount of data transfer occured for both acording to ##786
and my webserver

Thoughts??


my nickel's worth :)
Jer1

How much data was transfered in each instance?

[Jer1]

How much data was transfered in each instance?
about 24-25meg

Jer1

[3G Cables]

about 24-25meg

Jer1

Try the same test with an image.

I can tell you for sure that Sprint compresses images on the handset and the PC. You can see the compression it is so bad. Try viewing an image (picture) on your PC connected with a data cable then try the same thing with a broadband connection. Big difference.

I suppose they don’t do the same with video? That surprises me.

[Jer1]

Right compression happens for web/http (port 80) traffic in blazer

Not for direct video/audio streams

Jer1

Try the same test with an image.

I can tell you for sure that Sprint compresses images on the handset and the PC. You can see the compression it is so bad. Try viewing an image (picture) on your PC connected with a data cable then try the same thing with a broadband connection. Big difference.

I suppose they don’t do the same with video? That surprises me.

[teleguy]

I'd *REALLY* like to se in the TOS where ti says I cant stream audio/video allllll day long if I want to..........
I pay my bill I like to get what I pay for

I dont 'abuse it'

I just use it the way I see is inside the TOS and is USEFUL to me.

my 2 cents
Jer1
The Sprint PCS Vision Users Guide available as a .pdf at http://www1.sprintpcs.com/explore/ueContent.jsp?scTopic=pictureMail states "Plans/options with unlimited Sprint PCS Vision access are not available with Sprint PCS Vision phones used as a modem.....Sprint may deny or terminate service without notice for misuse."

It has always been in there, but Sprint tended to look the other way in the past. All that is changing now.

[3G Cables]

The Sprint PCS Vision Users Guide available as a .pdf at http://www1.sprintpcs.com/explore/ueContent.jsp?scTopic=pictureMail states "Plans/options with unlimited Sprint PCS Vision access are not available with Sprint PCS Vision phones used as a modem.....Sprint may deny or terminate service without notice for misuse."

It has always been in there, but Sprint tended to look the other way in the past. All that is changing now.

Teleguy, I would like to see some evidence to back your claim of "All that is changing now".

Thanks

[john1936]

Teleguy, I would like to see some evidence to back your claim of "All that is changing now".

Thanks

I'm not Teleguy and can't back his claim, but .... Sprint does sell data plans for use with phones as modems, i.e. 300 MB - $80. It is in the last pamphlet that I read but can't find much in forums about it. Do you think that will affect Sprints view of our continued use of Vision?

edited kb to mb

[3G Cables]

I'm not Teleguy and can't back his claim, but .... Sprint does sell data plans for use with phones as modems, i.e. 300 MB - $80. It is in the last pamphlet that I read but can't find much in forums about it. Do you think that will affect Sprints view of our continued use of Vision?

edited kb to mb

When I worked at Sprint about a year and a half ago they had those plans also. Actually there was an $80 per month unlimited plan but they pulled that one. So nothing has changed. It is all speculation at this point.

[john1936]

When I worked at Sprint about a year and a half ago they had those plans also. Actually there was an $80 per month unlimited plan but they pulled that one. So nothing has changed. It is all speculation at this point.

Sorry about that. I didn't know it was an old thing since I noted it wasn't in the brochure in Nov04 but was in Jan05..

[3G Cables]

Sorry about that. I didn't know it was an old thing since I noted it wasn't in the brochure in Nov04 but was in Jan05..

No, what you see is current. They stopped it for a while but it is back.

[Bohemian Iconoclast]

About a year and a half ago I set a customer up with both a voice plan and a data plan. The Sprint rep was concerned, until the customer got on and specifically requested to be charged for two plans.

Fast forward to a few weeks ago. We got a memo stating that this practice is now more accepted. Us 3rd party people set up the voice plan, then call in and add the data plan.

It's supposed to be SOP now, but I haven't done one since then, so I have no experience with the new policy.

[3G Cables]

About a year and a half ago I set a customer up with both a voice plan and a data plan. The Sprint rep was concerned, until the customer got on and specifically requested to be charged for two plans.

Fast forward to a few weeks ago. We got a memo stating that this practice is now more accepted. Us 3rd party people set up the voice plan, then call in and add the data plan.

It's supposed to be SOP now, but I haven't done one since then, so I have no experience with the new policy.

Furthermore there are no new reports of people being shut off for normal data usage while connected with a data cable to a cell phone.

[winger]

someone want to setup a paypay donation for $40 from SU users for me to get a phone w/ Vision and connect continuously for 8+ hrs per day and see what happens? Seriously I am willing if people are willing to put in a few cents $$$$ to see what really happens

[3G Cables]

someone want to setup a paypay donation for $40 from SU users for me to get a phone w/ Vision and connect continuously for 8+ hrs per day and see what happens? Seriously I am willing if people are willing to put in a few cents $$$$ to see what really happens

No need to. There are several reports of people here getting charged thousands of dollars for abusing their Vision connection. It is going to take a lot more than $40 when they sue you for non-payment and they will follow you by your social security number. I am warning you now, they do and will do this.

[mcdgi]

No need to. There are several reports of people here getting charged thousands of dollars for abusing their Vision connection. It is going to take a lot more than $40 when they sue you for non-payment and they will follow you by your social security number. I am warning you now, they do and will do this.

It sounds like you follow this issue pretty closely. I have heard, for example over in alt.cellular.sprintpcs some people say they think they know who this has happened to. Would you be able to give us a link to either a post in this forum or elsewhere, of someone getting charged thousands of dollars?

I think it would be helpful in the interest of keeping everyone responsible in their use.

[samsun17]

Connecting my cell phone to my laptop would be great for me to be able to check my companys web based email while I'm on the road. I wouldn't be doing any downloading and at most besides checking email, occasionally looking at other websites.

For me to do this and pay $80 a month is crazy and something I could never afford.

If it's so wrong and against the TOS to be using your cell phone to connect your computer to the Internet, why isn't that simply disabled?

[jeffkl]

"If it's so wrong and against the TOS to be using your cell phone to connect your computer to the Internet, why isn't that simply disabled?"

That is the $64,000 question!

I don't know if they are changing the policy, but from everything I have read if you just log in to get email while away on a business trip once in a while (eg 20-40 mb every once in a while) I think Sprint doesn't make a big deal about it. It's against policy but I think for such small usage they have not wanted to alienate people who are otherwise good customers and need a quick convenient way to get some email. So far from everything I have read they only go after the real abusers. I've logged in a few times myself now and then without any problems.

[3G Cables]

Connecting my cell phone to my laptop would be great for me to be able to check my companys web based email while I'm on the road. I wouldn't be doing any downloading and at most besides checking email, occasionally looking at other websites.

For me to do this and pay $80 a month is crazy and something I could never afford.

If it's so wrong and against the TOS to be using your cell phone to connect your computer to the Internet, why isn't that simply disabled?

It is not disabled so that you can pay them the $80 and use a cable to connect with your phone. If you don’t pay the $80 and abuse it then you will be charged. Infrequent use is fine, just don’t abuse it.

Perfect analogy; Why do cars go over 75 MPH? It is illegal to go over 75MPH and they could easily put a regulator but they don’t. You can get away with passing cars at 75MPH once in a while but if you abuse it you will get a ticket.

[3G Cables]

It sounds like you follow this issue pretty closely. I have heard, for example over in alt.cellular.sprintpcs some people say they think they know who this has happened to. Would you be able to give us a link to either a post in this forum or elsewhere, of someone getting charged thousands of dollars?

I think it would be helpful in the interest of keeping everyone responsible in their use.

I have seen actual people here that say they had over $1,000 in overcharges due to abusing Vision. I tried to search for it right now and can’t find them but I KNOW it is here somewhere. I just don’t have the time to search but I know you will find it if you search for the right words.

[samsun17]

Perfect analogy; Why do cars go over 75 MPH? It is illegal to go over 75MPH and they could easily put a regulator but they don’t. You can get away with passing cars at 75MPH once in a while but if you abuse it you will get a ticket.

You are right, it's the same difference.

It would be nice if they made something like a Fair and Flexable plan for data usage for casual users. Maybe start it at $10 per month, give you a base amount and if you go over that, it increases in $5 increments.

[3G Cables]

You are right, it's the same difference.

It would be nice if they made something like a Fair and Flexable plan for data usage for casual users. Maybe start it at $10 per month, give you a base amount and if you go over that, it increases in $5 increments.

They may just do that. Again, remember, they dont care if you use it just to check email once in a while or get on the web once in a while. As long as you dont abuse it there is no extra charge.

[mcdgi]

There have been some good posts in the alt.celluar.pcs news group on this issue from people who either were charged for using vision tethered to their laptop or people who say they work for Sprint and charged people. The following is from the 3/4/2005 thread called "#777 / Laptop / Booted from SprinPCS?"

**
post A " Iworked for Sprint PCS for about 18 months, up until July of last year. In that time, I dealt with a grand total of three users hit for charges
for online usage.

One user doesn't quite apply here. He tried to use his phone to dial
AOL. As if it were an actual modem. That drops the Vision phone into
Circuit-switched data mode, and Sprint charges $0.39/min. while you do
that. Plus a top connection speed (and that only under ideal
conditions) of 14.4kbps.

The other two used their phones as modems, and tried to convince me that
they'd never read any prohibition against it. One was hit for $750 in
online usage, the other for almost $1400. At $10/MB, it hadn't taken
either of them long to get shut off. And this does *not* count the
amount of usage it took to "trigger" the charge"

Post B "Hmm.. I *know* I posted my experience on this.
My wife and I used our new vision phones for very little for about 6
months with no effects, then we got nailed for virtually every minute.
SPCS took off the charges the first month without much hassle, but we
had already used close to an hour's worth in the next month.

I had more trouble dealing with those charges and have since not used
the tethered mode. Luckily I have either had Wi-Fi or wired ethernet
available to me when travelling -- and it not free it was covered by my
room rate or whatever"

[3G Cables]

There have been some good posts in the alt.celluar.pcs news group on this issue from people who either were charged for using vision tethered to their laptop or people who say they work for Sprint and charged people. The following is from the 3/4/2005 thread called "#777 / Laptop / Booted from SprinPCS?"

**
post A " Iworked for Sprint PCS for about 18 months, up until July of last year. In that time, I dealt with a grand total of three users hit for charges
for online usage.

One user doesn't quite apply here. He tried to use his phone to dial
AOL. As if it were an actual modem. That drops the Vision phone into
Circuit-switched data mode, and Sprint charges $0.39/min. while you do
that. Plus a top connection speed (and that only under ideal
conditions) of 14.4kbps.

The other two used their phones as modems, and tried to convince me that
they'd never read any prohibition against it. One was hit for $750 in
online usage, the other for almost $1400. At $10/MB, it hadn't taken
either of them long to get shut off. And this does *not* count the
amount of usage it took to "trigger" the charge"

Post B "Hmm.. I *know* I posted my experience on this.
My wife and I used our new vision phones for very little for about 6
months with no effects, then we got nailed for virtually every minute.
SPCS took off the charges the first month without much hassle, but we
had already used close to an hour's worth in the next month.

I had more trouble dealing with those charges and have since not used
the tethered mode. Luckily I have either had Wi-Fi or wired ethernet
available to me when travelling -- and it not free it was covered by my
room rate or whatever"

The holy-grail of questions to ask the person working for Sprint is, "what is the amount that triggers the audit"?

[sheureka]

Post B "Hmm.. I *know* I posted my experience on this.
My wife and I used our new vision phones for very little for about 6
months with no effects, then we got nailed for virtually every minute.
SPCS took off the charges the first month without much hassle, but we
had already used close to an hour's worth in the next month."
The former Sprint employee posted that story in another forum, and at least one of the users in question didn't have Vision enabled on his account at all. And I'd bet Poster B was also dialing an ISP - since Vision never charges by the minute. - sheureka

[wjcraig]

I just got off the phone with sprint technical support. They told me that they were not allowed to support the cell phone used as a modem anymore. I asked the guy to tell me why. He said that if you have the old service plan you can still do it because of legal reason. But as soon as you change your plan just a little bit they would take that option out of your service. The other thing is if you have the old service plan they want help you set it up. Sprint has plenty of data that's not the problem. They are charging for data usage now. He also gave me my data usage over the phone. Now the big question is how to setup the USB connection along with the dialup setting for connection to sprint using the #777 AKA (#PPP) Point to Point Protocol.

[3G Cables]

I just got off the phone with sprint technical support. They told me that they were not allowed to support the cell phone used as a modem anymore. I asked the guy to tell me why. He said that if you have the old service plan you can still do it because of legal reason. But as soon as you change your plan just a little bit they would take that option out of your service. The other thing is if you have the old service plan they want help you set it up. Sprint has plenty of data that's not the problem. They are charging for data usage now. He also gave me my data usage over the phone. Now the big question is how to setup the USB connection along with the dialup setting for connection to sprint using the #777 AKA (#PPP) Point to Point Protocol.

There is no plan which has not expired yet that allows for data cable use so I think that is BS. You just set up a manual dialup connection using #777 as the phone number. That is it.

[SteelersFan]

Last month I switched from the 2000 anytime minute plan with all the bells and whistles (7pm, unlimited vision/text messages, pcs to pcs yada yada yada), to an 800 min. free and clear plan with 4 phones on my plan. A couple of weeks ago I was in Arizona visiting my parents and had no access to the internet, and there was no WiFi available. I used my Sanyo 8200 hooked up to my laptop for a grand total of maybe one hour the entire trip. I doubt they'll charge me for it, as it was the first time in at least 6 months that I did this, but if they charge me extra because I changed plans as you say the CS rep told you, I will post my story here. Otherwise, since I know personally I do this about 3 times a year, that this more than likely will not trigger a dang thing.

Scott

[3G Cables]

Last month I switched from the 2000 anytime minute plan with all the bells and whistles (7pm, unlimited vision/text messages, pcs to pcs yada yada yada), to an 800 min. free and clear plan with 4 phones on my plan. A couple of weeks ago I was in Arizona visiting my parents and had no access to the internet, and there was no WiFi available. I used my Sanyo 8200 hooked up to my laptop for a grand total of maybe one hour the entire trip. I doubt they'll charge me for it, as it was the first time in at least 6 months that I did this, but if they charge me extra because I changed plans as you say the CS rep told you, I will post my story here. Otherwise, since I know personally I do this about 3 times a year, that this more than likely will not trigger a dang thing.

Scott

You are correct. In 1 hour there is no way you could have used enough bandwidth for them to care.

[ptshpboy23]

I'm interested in getting rid of my broadband connection (in order to save money, obviously). I'm paying $50/month for it, and I would like the ability to be on the internet with my cell. Soon I will be getting the appropriate cable to connect from my Sanyo MM-7400 to my computer with USB, to try it out briefly to see how fast it is, etc.

Here's my situation: I use the internet for e-mail, chat rooms, IM'ing, and shopping. If I were to use the phone as a means to connect to the internet via cell, I would stay away from streaming audio and video. However, I spend hours at a time on the internet on a daily basis.

I'm only 2 mos. into my current contract, and I have PCS Vision, and would plan on keeping that if I can get this to work with the computer.

Now here come the questions:
1. Do I need a separate ISP to connect to the internet?
2. How do I setup the phone to do it? I've heard *777 or something like that? Once connected, I'm assuming I'll be kicked off just like I do using PCS Vision when I browse pages? Even if I setup a 'ping' (as I've seen discussed), does that mean I will automatically cause more usage as a result of the ping?
3. What if I decide not even to bother with the 144K Sprint PCS network and get a separate ISP and use the phone to dial-in to a regular phone # of the ISP, obviously I will use my plan minutes and Sprint would have no way of knowing I am using it to 'dial-in' to the internet?, but I would be restricted to only 14.4K? ...And as long as call using my nightime/weekend minutes there are no extra charges? Could I cancel PCS Vision also going this route?
4. Given the usage details above, would I go over the 100MB threshold of data usage? Staying constantly connected for hours at a time, is that a problem as well?

Lastly, here may be an interesting thought!!!
... If you sign up for the PCS Vision MULTIMEDIA plan ($25) I bet you can get more data usage! Would I be hypothetically correct in saying that?

----------

You are correct. In 1 hour there is no way you could have used enough bandwidth for them to care.

[jeffkl]

Don't do it. This is EXACTLY what WILL get you into trouble with Sprint. This will be too much data usage and will rack up perhaps thousands of dollars in bills. Your computer also often does internet stuff in the background when connected (Windows and antivirus updates) and you could rack up data usage from that.

If you dial into your ISP the Sprint system recognizes the data transfer and will charge you $.39 per minute unless you have the old wireless web plan which you can't get if you don't already have it.

This is exactly what their policy is designed to prevent.



I'm interested in getting rid of my broadband connection (in order to save money, obviously). I'm paying $50/month for it, and I would like the ability to be on the internet with my cell. Soon I will be getting the appropriate cable to connect from my Sanyo MM-7400 to my computer with USB, to try it out briefly to see how fast it is, etc.

Here's my situation: I use the internet for e-mail, chat rooms, IM'ing, and shopping. If I were to use the phone as a means to connect to the internet via cell, I would stay away from streaming audio and video. However, I spend hours at a time on the internet on a daily basis.

I'm only 2 mos. into my current contract, and I have PCS Vision, and would plan on keeping that if I can get this to work with the computer.

Now here come the questions:
1. Do I need a separate ISP to connect to the internet?
2. How do I setup the phone to do it? I've heard *777 or something like that? Once connected, I'm assuming I'll be kicked off just like I do using PCS Vision when I browse pages? Even if I setup a 'ping' (as I've seen discussed), does that mean I will automatically cause more usage as a result of the ping?
3. What if I decide not even to bother with the 144K Sprint PCS network and get a separate ISP and use the phone to dial-in to a regular phone # of the ISP, obviously I will use my plan minutes and Sprint would have no way of knowing I am using it to 'dial-in' to the internet?, but I would be restricted to only 14.4K? ...And as long as call using my nightime/weekend minutes there are no extra charges? Could I cancel PCS Vision also going this route?
4. Given the usage details above, would I go over the 100MB threshold of data usage? Staying constantly connected for hours at a time, is that a problem as well?

Lastly, here may be an interesting thought!!!
... If you sign up for the PCS Vision MULTIMEDIA plan ($25) I bet you can get more data usage! Would I be hypothetically correct in saying that?

----------

[ptshpboy23]

Really? Wow. I don't understand that though, isn't it MY CHOICE who I want to call and when? Who cares if I call an ISP?... basically my minutes in my plan are deducted anyway, correct? So you are saying if I use a separate ISP and use my phone to call in to that ISP (using a STANDARD phone number, not #777 or anything like that), I will STILL be charged .39¢ minute?

Now, if I use my current PCS Vision and...
- Do NOT have it PINGED
- Do NOT use it for any web/antivirus updates
- Do NOT use it for streaming audio/video

Then I should be OK if I don't go over say 100MB? Or am I just a fool for thinking I could get away with it?

Thanks again!

Don't do it. This is EXACTLY what WILL get you into trouble with Sprint. This will be too much data usage and will rack up perhaps thousands of dollars in bills. Your computer also often does internet stuff in the background when connected (Windows and antivirus updates) and you could rack up data usage from that.

If you dial into your ISP the Sprint system recognizes the data transfer and will charge you $.39 per minute unless you have the old wireless web plan which you can't get if you don't already have it.

This is exactly what their policy is designed to prevent.

[MickCole]

It's a bit ironic that you can routinely stream as much audio as you like, as long as it's to your device, but as soon as you tether you have to worry about how much bandwidth you are using. I've read that the acceptable amount of tethered usage varies from a few hundred to several hundred MB/month, but seen little hard evidence.
My usage is strictly to the device, as I obtained in writing from Customer Service that I could stream as much as I like, as long as it's strictly to the device. I routinely use 80 or 90 MB/day, and rarely go below 20 or 30.
Mick

[jeffkl]

Yes, you will be charged $.39 a minute for data. They have always done this. When they had the old wireless web plan data calls came out of your minutes if you subscribed to the wireless web plan, and if you didn't they would charge you $.39 a minute for data usage. Most cell phone companies have some restrictions regarding data transfer.

As for the #777 feature, they really don't support it at all and if it were me I wouldn't risk leaving it on for hours every day with big or little data usage. The 100 MB limit is just a guess by users. They can charge you for ANY use of it. They probably won't if you use it minimally, but I wouldn't use it in a way that would temp them. I think if people who use it do so sporadically and minimally they probably won't bother otherwise good customers. But if you use it frequently -- then I think you're taking your chances. It's a chance I wouldn't take since they could charge you a tremendous amount of money.

Really? Wow. I don't understand that though, isn't it MY CHOICE who I want to call and when? Who cares if I call an ISP?... basically my minutes in my plan are deducted anyway, correct? So you are saying if I use a separate ISP and use my phone to call in to that ISP (using a STANDARD phone number, not #777 or anything like that), I will STILL be charged .39¢ minute?

Now, if I use my current PCS Vision and...
- Do NOT have it PINGED
- Do NOT use it for any web/antivirus updates
- Do NOT use it for streaming audio/video

Then I should be OK if I don't go over say 100MB? Or am I just a fool for thinking I could get away with it?

Thanks again!

[ptshpboy23]

Can someone explain what tethered usage means? Does this mean constant use with a ping setup?

I am already enrolled with PCS Vision and if I use #777, how much would they charge for EXTRA data usage beyond the norm? I have heard somewhere in the range of .02¢ for each kilobyte? So, 20MB would cost $20.00?

Lastly, if I enroll in the PCS Vision Multimedia feature (another $10), does that pretty much guarantee me more data transfer?

Thanks again!

[MickCole]

Can someone explain what tethered usage means? Does this mean constant use with a ping setup?

I am already enrolled with PCS Vision and if I use #777, how much would they charge for EXTRA data usage beyond the norm? I have heard somewhere in the range of .02¢ for each kilobyte? So, 20MB would cost $20.00?

Lastly, if I enroll in the PCS Vision Multimedia feature (another $10), does that pretty much guarantee me more data transfer?

Thanks again!
Tethered usage means connecting your phone to a computer or pda using either a bluetooth or cable connection, and downloading to your computer or pda using the phone for an internet connection. Technically, any tetheried usage is a violation of the Sprint Terms of Service, which can result in termination of Unlimited Vision. Many people get away with it; there have a few reports of the Sprint "data police" giving people grief for excessive tethered usage. It has been reported that the data police have considerable discretion in deciding what constitutes excessive usage. Most of the cases I have read about where people ran up huge data charges seem to be the result of not having "Unlimited Vision" added to their plan, either because they didn't think they would use Vision enough to justify the cost, or a Cusomer Service Rep didn't set their account up properly.
Mick

[3G Cables]

Really? Wow. I don't understand that though, isn't it MY CHOICE who I want to call and when? Who cares if I call an ISP?... basically my minutes in my plan are deducted anyway, correct? So you are saying if I use a separate ISP and use my phone to call in to that ISP (using a STANDARD phone number, not #777 or anything like that), I will STILL be charged .39¢ minute?

Now, if I use my current PCS Vision and...
- Do NOT have it PINGED
- Do NOT use it for any web/antivirus updates
- Do NOT use it for streaming audio/video

Then I should be OK if I don't go over say 100MB? Or am I just a fool for thinking I could get away with it?

Thanks again!

You don’t understand. When you make a data call to an ISP, your call gets routed to the Sprint modem pool (in their infrastructure) and you are charged 39 cents per minute. How can they tell you may be asking yourself? Because it is a data call and has that information encoded in the data transfer handshake process. It is your choice to call whatever number you want. And it is Sprints choice to bill you 39 cents per minute for using their modem pool. Sprint cares if you call an ISP because it is using up their modem pool. You will have minutes deducted and be charged 39 cents per minute.

[ptshpboy23]

Thank you for your help. So i guess nobody in their right mind would pay at least another $10 for an ISP, plus using their cell phone plan minutes, plus 39¢/minute!

So, I guess I go back to the #777 thing. Like I said I have the unlimited vision plan option added to my account, so what is the WORST case scenario. I have heard:

1. You get a warning letter, and by the 3rd time they cancel you.
2. They cancel your unlimited PCS vision altogether.
3. They cancel your account entirely?
4. They charge you for each kilobyte beyond the threshold limit.

Lastly, how would they know the difference between accessing Vision via the phone itself vs. the computer? In other words, does the phone execute a #777 call itself everytime it goes on the internet? To me, there seems to be a gray area where... how they will be able to do distinguish the difference between what is acceptable usage and what is not. In other words, is it really cut and dry -- say:

- I used 2MB on my phone for PCS vision.
- I used 100MB using #777 on my laptop.

... They charge me for the 100MB "excess" usage. How much would that excess usage actually cost?

Secretly, I have this idea that adding the Multmedia Vision Plan for the extra $10/month will get me more alloted data access? Is there truth to this statement? Obviously streaming videos (even at 15fps) MUST use more data!

Just my 2¢... :)

You don’t understand. When you make a data call to an ISP, your call gets routed to the Sprint modem pool (in their infrastructure) and you are charged 39 cents per minute. How can they tell you may be asking yourself? Because it is a data call and has that information encoded in the data transfer handshake process. It is your choice to call whatever number you want. And it is Sprints choice to bill you 39 cents per minute for using their modem pool. Sprint cares if you call an ISP because it is using up their modem pool. You will have minutes deducted and be charged 39 cents per minute.

[jeffkl]

One more point -- I have DSL that is always on with a firewall. Everyday my firewall reports potential attacks. Without the firewall someone might get into the computer. While they would find nothing, the transfer of data back and forth would go through my internet connection. If you keep your computer connected to hours through Vision, even with no data transfer, if a hacker gets into your computer, just being there will use up data adding to the amount of data you are using through your Sprint connection.

You don’t understand. When you make a data call to an ISP, your call gets routed to the Sprint modem pool (in their infrastructure) and you are charged 39 cents per minute. How can they tell you may be asking yourself? Because it is a data call and has that information encoded in the data transfer handshake process. It is your choice to call whatever number you want. And it is Sprints choice to bill you 39 cents per minute for using their modem pool. Sprint cares if you call an ISP because it is using up their modem pool. You will have minutes deducted and be charged 39 cents per minute.

[g4lt]

One more point -- I have DSL that is always on with a firewall. Everyday my firewall reports potential attacks. Without the firewall someone might get into the computer. While they would find nothing, the transfer of data back and forth would go through my internet connection. If you keep your computer connected to hours through Vision, even with no data transfer, if a hacker gets into your computer, just being there will use up data adding to the amount of data you are using through your Sprint connection.

So basically, it's the CUSTOMER's fault that Sprint has lousy router-based firewalling?

[ptshpboy23]

Well I haven't actually tried #777 yet, but as long as you have Windows XP there is a way you can turn your firewall on, through the network connections options. Further, if you do NOT have a constant connection, there is VERY LITTLE chance anyone could get in anyway. By this I mean not having your connection "pinged". So yeah, you might wait a few seconds for the phone to connect, but each time you are off nobody can find you.

DSL and Cable lines are the WORST for firewall, since you are always connected and usually always have the same IP address, unless your unplug your cable modem or router (or DSL line for that matter) and re-connect. When you have the same IP address people can find you time and time again and get in to your computer, see all your files and have access to pretty much anything UNLESS you have a firewall.

Lastly, the new Service Pack 2 by Microsoft address the firewall issue even better, albeit a bit more slower than Service Pack 1.

So basically, it's the CUSTOMER's fault that Sprint has lousy router-based firewalling?

[3G Cables]

Thank you for your help. So i guess nobody in their right mind would pay at least another $10 for an ISP, plus using their cell phone plan minutes, plus 39¢/minute!

So, I guess I go back to the #777 thing. Like I said I have the unlimited vision plan option added to my account, so what is the WORST case scenario. I have heard:

1. You get a warning letter, and by the 3rd time they cancel you.
2. They cancel your unlimited PCS vision altogether.
3. They cancel your account entirely?
4. They charge you for each kilobyte beyond the threshold limit.

Lastly, how would they know the difference between accessing Vision via the phone itself vs. the computer? In other words, does the phone execute a #777 call itself everytime it goes on the internet? To me, there seems to be a gray area where... how they will be able to do distinguish the difference between what is acceptable usage and what is not. In other words, is it really cut and dry -- say:

- I used 2MB on my phone for PCS vision.
- I used 100MB using #777 on my laptop.

... They charge me for the 100MB "excess" usage. How much would that excess usage actually cost?

Secretly, I have this idea that adding the Multmedia Vision Plan for the extra $10/month will get me more alloted data access? Is there truth to this statement? Obviously streaming videos (even at 15fps) MUST use more data!

Just my 2¢... :)

*This is how it works*

They charge you thousands of dollars for your over-usage AND shut off your Vision. If you really piss them off and use too much data they cancel your account all together. That is what happens. You do not get warnings.

They certainly can tell the difference. Every time your phone accesses Vision weather it is by cable or directly from the handset it has to go through Sprints Gateway. Your phone sends information in the packet header which tells them how you are connecting. If you are connecting with the handset it first goes to Sprints Vision homepage by default. It knows by that you are connecting with the handset alone without a data cable. If you are using a data cable it does not first go to the main Sprint gateway default so they know you are connected with a data cable. Do they care? Not if you are just using it sparingly. If you abuse it you will get what is coming to you which I explained above. There is no gray area at all. They know. You can use a lot of usage, unlimited if you are connecting through Sprints gateway with the handset. However if you use a data cable to connect it is totally different and they do know. Adding the multimedia plan will make no difference. As explained they can tell HOW you connect.

[3G Cables]

One more point -- I have DSL that is always on with a firewall. Everyday my firewall reports potential attacks. Without the firewall someone might get into the computer. While they would find nothing, the transfer of data back and forth would go through my internet connection. If you keep your computer connected to hours through Vision, even with no data transfer, if a hacker gets into your computer, just being there will use up data adding to the amount of data you are using through your Sprint connection.

There are not hackers trying to get into your computer everyday. In fact likely none of those reported attacks are hackers. Your firewall software reports websites or other internet activity which tries to access ports commonly used by hackers. False reports are reported all the time by things such as chat programs, ftp, cookies, Active X, etc. This does not mean a hacker is trying to get into your computer. It means the ports that hackers commonly use are trying to be accesses but it is what I just described instead of a hacker. Yes, there is a lot that goes on behind the scenes of an internet connection and will keep your activity a bit higher but all these behind the scene issues use up VERY little data because they are command lines for the most part, they are not graphic intensive or data intensive. The Sprint network uses its own protocol which hackers have not used. There has not been 1 single report of a hacker getting on the Sprint Vision network. The network is much smaller than the *real* internet backbone.

[3G Cables]

Well I haven't actually tried #777 yet, but as long as you have Windows XP there is a way you can turn your firewall on, through the network connections options. Further, if you do NOT have a constant connection, there is VERY LITTLE chance anyone could get in anyway. By this I mean not having your connection "pinged". So yeah, you might wait a few seconds for the phone to connect, but each time you are off nobody can find you.

DSL and Cable lines are the WORST for firewall, since you are always connected and usually always have the same IP address, unless your unplug your cable modem or router (or DSL line for that matter) and re-connect. When you have the same IP address people can find you time and time again and get in to your computer, see all your files and have access to pretty much anything UNLESS you have a firewall.

Lastly, the new Service Pack 2 by Microsoft address the firewall issue even better, albeit a bit more slower than Service Pack 1.

Software firewalls including Windows firewall are a joke. If you want a real firewall simply get one at Best Buy or somewhere. It is a hardware firewall you want not software. MOST people do not have the same/static IP. It cost a lot more to have a static IP since you can serve with it a lot easier. When DSL first came out many years ago they were issuing static IP’s by default. Now it is all dynamic. Every time there is a change in the IP stack you are issued a new IP. You don’t know this because it is behind the scenes. Every time there is a service pack update release by Microsoft hackers get it also. They can see what the update addresses and they use that info to get into computers that don’t have the update. So a HARDWARE firewall protects against this not a SOFTWARE one.

[ptshpboy23]

Ah ha! So I guess if you connect to http://vision.sprintpcs.com/ that is why it does not work on the computer?

Let me preface this statement by saying you already have the associated data cable (USB), PCS Vision unlimited. Here's a hypothetical:

1. You FIRST connect with your phone to http://vision.sprintpcs.com/
2. You THEN connect with your USB cable for the amount of time during that session.
3. You repeatedly go back to http://vision.sprintpcs.com/ often or by PING.
4. You browse often enough on the HANDSET and via cable side-by-side.

Will this then cancel out any hint of #777 usage? Does the phone itself excute a #777 call command for it's own data?

Thanks again!



*This is how it works*

They charge you thousands of dollars for your over-usage AND shut off your Vision. If you really piss them off and use too much data they cancel your account all together. That is what happens. You do not get warnings.

They certainly can tell the difference. Every time your phone accesses Vision weather it is by cable or directly from the handset it has to go through Sprints Gateway. Your phone sends information in the packet header which tells them how you are connecting. If you are connecting with the handset it first goes to Sprints Vision homepage by default. It knows by that you are connecting with the handset alone without a data cable. If you are using a data cable it does not first go to the main Sprint gateway default so they know you are connected with a data cable. Do they care? Not if you are just using it sparingly. If you abuse it you will get what is coming to you which I explained above. There is no gray area at all. They know. You can use a lot of usage, unlimited if you are connecting through Sprints gateway with the handset. However if you use a data cable to connect it is totally different and they do know. Adding the multimedia plan will make no difference. As explained they can tell HOW you connect.

[ptshpboy23]

Lastly, is Sprint able to see each and every URL that is accessed? In other words, on sites that can't be accessed via the phone itself, is that a red flag for them?

[3G Cables]

Ah ha! So I guess if you connect to http://vision.sprintpcs.com/ that is why it does not work on the computer?

Let me preface this statement by saying you already have the associated data cable (USB), PCS Vision unlimited. Here's a hypothetical:

1. You FIRST connect with your phone to http://vision.sprintpcs.com/
2. You THEN connect with your USB cable for the amount of time during that session.
3. You repeatedly go back to http://vision.sprintpcs.com/ often or by PING.
4. You browse often enough on the HANDSET and via cable side-by-side.

Will this then cancel out any hint of #777 usage? Does the phone itself excute a #777 call command for it's own data?

Thanks again!

No, no matter what you do, a hardware signature is sent to the Sprint Vision gateway telling them how you are connecting. With what phone, your ESN number, weather it is connecting with a cable or not. They can tell. No matter how hard you try and spoof it they will know.

With your hypothetical it will show connects and disconnects every time from your handset and your USB connection. It will not work as you think it will. No, using #777 in a dialing program is not what your handset does when it connects to Vision. It is WAP vs. #777 two different things.

[ptshpboy23]

Now, is this a LEGAL, conceivable option? I wouldn't mind paying outright for the connection card. Further, I would have to investigate as to whether my account is able to add the 2nd line. But, if all is well and good, and I purchase the connection card (with a new phone #), and I add the vision to that phone as suggested ($10), and pay for the 2nd line ($20), I really could have unlimited PCS vision on my laptop LEGALLY for $30.00/month?!

Now THAT sounds like a good option vs. me paying $50.00 for broadband when I hardly use it for downloads/streaming. I'm assuming I would get a max 144kbps rate or what is the general consensus on speed?

Further, I think it's awesome you could literally be anywhere on the PCS network and have internet access without having to PAY. Now we are not talking about WiMax, correct, this is just PCS vision with the card?

Thanks!


Well what I did to get unlimited vision use was to get a wireless connection card....find a store representative that is friendly and tell them you want to ad a line to your current plan...they will ask you if you want to share minutes, and then will charge you an extra 10 for vision on the phone....but you will now have unlimited vision for 30 bucks a month....

[ptshpboy23]

But wait... don't I have to pay for data usage, or is this only with WiMax in the WiMax zones or something like that?

[3G Cables]

Now, is this a LEGAL, conceivable option? I wouldn't mind paying outright for the connection card. Further, I would have to investigate as to whether my account is able to add the 2nd line. But, if all is well and good, and I purchase the connection card (with a new phone #), and I add the vision to that phone as suggested ($10), and pay for the 2nd line ($20), I really could have unlimited PCS vision on my laptop LEGALLY for $30.00/month?!

Now THAT sounds like a good option vs. me paying $50.00 for broadband when I hardly use it for downloads/streaming. I'm assuming I would get a max 144kbps rate or what is the general consensus on speed?

Further, I think it's awesome you could literally be anywhere on the PCS network and have internet access without having to PAY. Now we are not talking about WiMax, correct, this is just PCS vision with the card?

Thanks!

You can do an ad-a-line but that doesn’t change anything. They will still see you are connecting with a data cable with that phone. I have personally done it. Works great for occasional use but you will get all phones on your account shut off and fined heavily if you use it the way you plan on doing it.

The Datacards range from $170-$299 and you can only dial #777 on it and it has a data rate structure; 20MB $40, 50MB $55, UNLIMITED $80.

That is the only way to get unlimited data no matter what scenario you come up with.

[3G Cables]

But wait... don't I have to pay for data usage, or is this only with WiMax in the WiMax zones or something like that?

Where do you get the terms "WiMax"?

[3G Cables]

Lastly, is Sprint able to see each and every URL that is accessed? In other words, on sites that can't be accessed via the phone itself, is that a red flag for them?

Yes Sprint can see every URL you access and any data you choose to transfer.

[ptshpboy23]

I guess I was referring to getting a 2nd line with the data card. Or do I _not_ need a 2nd line for that? If I get the data card, there is no phone # associated with it then? So as I am already a Sprint customer do they just add the charges to my existing bill or is it under a separate account?

If you're telling me I get unlimited 144K access anytime, anywhere, anyplace for $80 that might be tempting since geez if you're in your car you could be driving down the road and STILL be connected to the internet, all done WIRELESSLY. But still that's $30 more than broadband.

I wonder how much 50MB really accounts for. If I'm in chat rooms, IM'ing and just browsing, does that really add up to 50MB fast?

Thanks again guys!


You can do an ad-a-line but that doesn’t change anything. They will still see you are connecting with a data cable with that phone. I have personally done it. Works great for occasional use but you will get all phones on your account shut off and fined heavily if you use it the way you plan on doing it.

The Datacards range from $170-$299 and you can only dial #777 on it and it has a data rate structure; 20MB $40, 50MB $55, UNLIMITED $80.

That is the only way to get unlimited data no matter what scenario you come up with.

[3G Cables]

I guess I was referring to getting a 2nd line with the data card. Or do I _not_ need a 2nd line for that? If I get the data card, there is no phone # associated with it then? So as I am already a Sprint customer do they just add the charges to my existing bill or is it under a separate account?

If you're telling me I get unlimited 144K access anytime, anywhere, anyplace for $80 that might be tempting since geez if you're in your car you could be driving down the road and STILL be connected to the internet, all done WIRELESSLY. But still that's $30 more than broadband.

I wonder how much 50MB really accounts for. If I'm in chat rooms, IM'ing and just browsing, does that really add up to 50MB fast?

Thanks again guys!

You do not need a second line to get a data card. You just get the card, pay the $80 per month, and yes, anywhere you are on the Sprint VISION network you will have unlimited internet at 144k (will not work while roaming on other networks). The fun part is that within the next few months Sprint is launching EV-DO and that will be just as fast or FASTER than your current DSL! (300-500k/sec with up to 2MBits/sec!) If I were you I would just wait. The EV-DO hardware card is out there and is being beta tested in many cities so it may work right now and it is backward compatible with the current Sprint network at 144k/sec. You know, I might just get one myself. This is sounding gooood since I personally know they are beta testing it now in my city (Los Angeles) =)

If you want it right now go with Verizon. They have an EV-DO card and EV-DO is up in most major cities officially. Here is the Sprint EV-DO card that you can get right now and EV-DO MIGHT be beta tested in your neighborhood but maybe not.
http://www.sprint.com/business/products/phones/aircard580_connectionCards.jsp

Actually not sure if it is backwards compatible with the current Sprint network but I am sure it is because they are selling it right now.

[ptshpboy23]

OK, in a current 13 hr. session I have logged approximately 145,000 sent and 222,000 received. is that 145K and 222K respectively? I am trying to determine my average usage.

Also is it just the $80 flat fee or are they charging you a TON of surcharges, sales, local, federal, taxes, etc.?

[3G Cables]

OK, in a current 13 hr. session I have logged approximately 145,000 sent and 222,000 received. is that 145K and 222K respectively? I am trying to determine my average usage.

Also is it just the $80 flat fee or are they charging you a TON of surcharges, sales, local, federal, taxes, etc.?

I would not be doing that if I were you. Your account is registered under your social security number and if they do fine you and shut you down it is not a charge you can get out of. Also you will not be able to open another account with Sprint ever. The choice is yours. I use to work for Sprint so I have some insider information. I would be very careful if I were you with your usage.

You will have to ask Sprint about the taxes and surcharges. I am not sure about that one.

[ptshpboy23]

Nah, that was with the cable modem!

What am I using given those figures? 500K? 500MB? I'm not sure?

I would not be doing that if I were you. Your account is registered under your social security number and if they do fine you and shut you down it is not a charge you can get out of. Also you will not be able to open another account with Sprint ever. The choice is yours. I use to work for Sprint so I have some insider information. I would be very careful if I were you with your usage.

You will have to ask Sprint about the taxes and surcharges. I am not sure about that one.

[3G Cables]

Nah, that was with the cable modem!

What am I using given those figures? 500K? 500MB? I'm not sure?

I don’t know what scale those numbers are in because I don’t have that program open in front of me. It should say "bytes" or "k/kilobytes" etc

Where do you get the terms "WiMax"?

[sprintuser9]

Hi,
Just found this forum within the last hour. Great source of info on a subject that's been bugging me a lot lately. You might find this interesting. Since last summer I've been using my VI660 Samsung, PCS Vision Premium Pack, FutureDial software with usb cable to connect to the Internet, often, but for short amounts of time while on Amtrak and at hotels without ever being charged extra. Now, for the past few month I've been finding a new charge on my online page - CASUAL USE PCS WIRELESS WEB MINUTES - running from 1 to 7 minutes @ $.39/min. The folks at the Sprint Store and on phone didn't have much of an explanation. Sprint email replied "Your account shows that your browser was launched for 7 minutes last November 1, 2004. Since, you have no Wireless Web plan, the minutes was reflected on your usage detail. Moreover, please be informed that casual usage of wireless web cost $.39 per minute." It seemed some weekends there would be no charges. Yesterday, Sunday, it showed up again. I'm afraid to tether up the old laptop not knowing what to expect. What's the latest that you all may know? Thanks.

[mcdgi]

Hi,
Just found this forum within the last hour. Great source of info on a subject that's been bugging me a lot lately. You might find this interesting. Since last summer I've been using my VI660 Samsung, PCS Vision Premium Pack, FutureDial software with usb cable to connect to the Internet, often, but for short amounts of time while on Amtrak and at hotels without ever being charged extra. Now, for the past few month I've been finding a new charge on my online page - CASUAL USE PCS WIRELESS WEB MINUTES - running from 1 to 7 minutes @ $.39/min. The folks at the Sprint Store and on phone didn't have much of an explanation. Sprint email replied "Your account shows that your browser was launched for 7 minutes last November 1, 2004. Since, you have no Wireless Web plan, the minutes was reflected on your usage detail. Moreover, please be informed that casual usage of wireless web cost $.39 per minute." It seemed some weekends there would be no charges. Yesterday, Sunday, it showed up again. I'm afraid to tether up the old laptop not knowing what to expect. What's the latest that you all may know? Thanks.


I was wondering if you could clarify if you were connecting using the dialup connection to call #777 or if you were calling your landline dialup ISP?

I am under the impression that dialing up your landline ISP you could and would be billed by the minute. If you dialed #777, and if they decided to charge you, would be billed by the kilobyte. Perhaps they are billing by the minute now even for #777?

[SteelersFan]

I just got my bill in the mail a couple of days ago, and there were no extra charges for the little bit of internet usage I had with my phone hooked as a modem. I had replied earlier in the month that I did about 3 hours total while travelling in the beginning of March. I use this method of connecting to the internet approximately 4 times a year while travelling and never had a problem. Again, stressing what many people have said in this message thread.......use it wisely and don't abuse it, and you probably will never have to worry about getting zapped because of TOS violations.

[Nugo]

Man I've been on half the day today....wish I know *** the hard core solid-line of evidence or whatever was. All I"m using is messenger

[harddaysnight]

If you use your phone as modem and they catch you it teminates your contract and you may get hit with ETF $150.00.
There is a ph# to call for data modem accounts 1-866-581-9266.
Like previously said if you use the phone very little as modem you may get away with it, but I wouldn't recommend it. ETF fee is high and they may cancel your account for breaking your contract.

[RadioShackKryl]

Hello, I just read this thread from beginning to end and have found it very interesting. Forgive me if this is a repeat of information in other threads, but I thought it was relevent here. According to the newest Sprint PCS Service Plans Guide (dated APR2005), they outline their charges for data usage on customers that have PCS Vision on their plans. Right above the chart it even says "Perfect for people who use their Sprint PCS Phone as a modem". (So, this pertains to the #777 teathered laptop/pda people.) They break down the charges as follows:

Sprint PCS Vision usage / Monthly Charge
10 MB / $20
20MB / $40
50 MB / $55
300 MB / $80

And under the chart it says:
"Includes Web Access and Sprint PCS Picture Mail, Sprint PCS Video Mail, Sprint TV and 100 SMS Messaging Usage."

So, it appears that they are lumping the data usage on the handset and the modem/laptop usage into one category. So, I'd stay under 10MB a month unless you want to get charged more. It would be too easy to go over this with a teathered laptop.

[3G Cables]

Hello, I just read this thread from beginning to end and have found it very interesting. Forgive me if this is a repeat of information in other threads, but I thought it was relevent here. According to the newest Sprint PCS Service Plans Guide (dated APR2005), they outline their charges for data usage on customers that have PCS Vision on their plans. Right above the chart it even says "Perfect for people who use their Sprint PCS Phone as a modem". (So, this pertains to the #777 teathered laptop/pda people.) They break down the charges as follows:

Sprint PCS Vision usage / Monthly Charge
10 MB / $20
20MB / $40
50 MB / $55
300 MB / $80

And under the chart it says:
"Includes Web Access and Sprint PCS Picture Mail, Sprint PCS Video Mail, Sprint TV and 100 SMS Messaging Usage."

So, it appears that they are lumping the data usage on the handset and the modem/laptop usage into one category. So, I'd stay under 10MB a month unless you want to get charged more. It would be too easy to go over this with a teathered laptop.

I have used over 100MB's this month already with a cable so we will see if they mean it or not. If you don’t hear back from me within 30 days at this thread then there was not overcharge.

[nerys]

I regularly use my phone with my laptop (by regularly I mean I have used it often in the last 3-4 years including back when it was 2g) the sprint guy told me back then when I got switched to vision that they do not support laptop connection any longer but I am grandfathered in. that is why I have never altered my plan ot updated my contract.

When traveling or at hotels without wifi ec.. I am VERY network conscientious when I use it e-mail and basic web only get off when I am done and NO pingers to waist network bandwidth etc..

When I do have to do heavy uploading (such as my live website) I wait till late at night during off peak time. I have never had a problem.

I use it whenver I want or need it but always respectfully and as minimally as possible.

Chris Taylor
http://www.multipodaction.com/

[Alchemy]

Hello, I just read this thread from beginning to end and have found it very interesting. Forgive me if this is a repeat of information in other threads, but I thought it was relevent here. According to the newest Sprint PCS Service Plans Guide (dated APR2005), they outline their charges for data usage on customers that have PCS Vision on their plans. Right above the chart it even says "Perfect for people who use their Sprint PCS Phone as a modem". (So, this pertains to the #777 teathered laptop/pda people.) They break down the charges as follows:

Sprint PCS Vision usage / Monthly Charge
10 MB / $20
20MB / $40
50 MB / $55
300 MB / $80

And under the chart it says:
"Includes Web Access and Sprint PCS Picture Mail, Sprint PCS Video Mail, Sprint TV and 100 SMS Messaging Usage."

So, it appears that they are lumping the data usage on the handset and the modem/laptop usage into one category. So, I'd stay under 10MB a month unless you want to get charged more. It would be too easy to go over this with a teathered laptop.

The overage charge is presumably the same flat $.002/Kilobyte that the data card plans currently have?

Maybe I am being dumb, but I hope the "lumping the data usage on the handset and the modem" would only apply to one chosen line that this Vision Plan was added onto? For example, with 5 lines billed together, I would hate to go from Unlimited data usage on the *handsets* of the 4 other AAPs to $.002/KB just to be able to "legally" tether a laptop to the 5th line.
If that were true, only an $80 (non-business, not-yet-offered) Unlimited Data Vision Plan would be even worth considering. - Alchemy

[Orbitz]

So...if the above post is accurate...do you actually need to sign up for a plan...or will you automatically be billed as per the chart if you go over 10MB? Also, does this lessen the chances of getting your account shut off if you are using #777 without calling ahead of time and signing up for a plan? I am just wondering if you can use it on the fly so to speak...I often go a month or two without traveling very much...then have a month I am on the road 20+ days...calling up and adding the service then taking it off for slow months would be a pain..not to mention resetting my 18 month clock. I would just a soon pay monthly and not have to worry about my usage...but if it is flixible (i.e. You only pay for it when you use it) that would be great :) Either way, I don't want my account cancelled because I was too busy to count kbytes...for me it is worth $50 a month just to not have to worry about it if that is the only "legal" way to handle it.

[Alchemy]

So...if the above post is accurate...do you actually need to sign up for a plan...or will you automatically be billed as per the chart if you go over 10MB? Also, does this lessen the chances of getting your account shut off if you are using #777 without calling ahead of time and signing up for a plan? I am just wondering if you can use it on the fly so to speak...I often go a month or two without traveling very much...then have a month I am on the road 20+ days...calling up and adding the service then taking it off for slow months would be a pain..not to mention resetting my 18 month clock. I would just a soon pay monthly and not have to worry about my usage...but if it is flixible (i.e. You only pay for it when you use it) that would be great :) Either way, I don't want my account cancelled because I was too busy to count kbytes...for me it is worth $50 a month just to not have to worry about it if that is the only "legal" way to handle it.

Some of the same things I was wondering about... Following up,the Sprint store didnt have any "new brochures", but a local Radio Shack did. It does say additional data usage is $.002/KB for these "Sprint PCS Vision - Data Usage ONLY" *plans*, and the plan apparently can be done as an add-on for only one line out of an account (like an AddAPhone - per Sprint tel CS [tho the RS store rep said it had to be exactly the *opposite* - for the "whole account" - I'm gonna choose to believe Sprint tel CS this time...]), but it also says they have a *1yr Advantage Agreement* required for these plans that is added onto your account. I take that to mean that you wouldnt be able to swap on and off within the year without getting hit with an ETF.

IMHO they will probably still hit you with $.01/KB (instead of $.002) on a line if you dont sign up for a plan (and possibly worse things), using your fear that you might get into trouble, as well as pay high$ overages to push you into one of these plans for "insurance".

At least they seem to be finally dealing with what has been a confused mess for years, and giving their customers some "legal" options to do what was originally encouraged with 3G cables and install disks sold by Sprint, then for a while severely punished, then just became variable and "fuzzy", as the title of this thread says.

P.S. Dont plan on using that high speed connection for non-Sprint VOIP, like Vonage SoftPhone. The brochure has quite a bit of new Provisions, including not to be used as a "substitute for private lines", or "systems that drive continuous heavy traffic or data sessions." - Alchemy

[nerys]

I think you might be mistaken. .002 per kb would be great !! I was certain its .02/kb ? ie 2 cents per kb ?

not 1/5th of a cent per kb ?

Chris Taylor
http://www.zodiacreview.com/

[Alchemy]

I think you might be mistaken. .002 per kb would be great !! I was certain its .02/kb ? ie 2 cents per kb ?

not 1/5th of a cent per kb ?

Chris Taylor
http://www.zodiacreview.com/

Nope, the 1/5 cent/KB is correct for data plans, infact, was very briefly $.001 in the beginnings of Vision for data cards. That's not really as cheap as it may seem, tho. Using my existing *data card* sparingly on trips a few times a year, I found I could very easily rack up a bit less than 30MB/mo for those few months - that would be around $60/month on those few months with the above $40 handset data plan ($40 for 20MB plan + $20 for overage of 10MB x $.002/MB = $60 total). Dont forget that all other Vision usage on that line done thru the handset - like Web, Picture Mail, Video Mail, Sprint TV, etc., also would now count toward your data usage on that line. Those KB's really add up. -Alchemy

[philsmith]

I just spent over an hour with sprint to learn everything that is posted in this thread. I am new to Sprint and one thing the sale rep informed me when I bought the service was the ability to use a data cable connected to my laptop for slow internet access. I have found the speed to be very good and once I got setup it is stable. I first heard that Sprint does not support this ability today when I contacted tech support for help. His information was very close to being verbatim to what was stated from Klintman in the tread of discusstions.

Thanks for the confirmation...

[CAIN505]

i use mine for heavy d/l'ing too but the sprint police will come down on you if you use it to much youll get a letter saying that a recent review of your account reveilled a extemlly large amount of data minutes used thus u must be useing it for a modem blah blah blah :bang: :bang:

[3G Cables]

i use mine for heavy d/l'ing too but the sprint police will come down on you if you use it to much youll get a letter saying that a recent review of your account reveilled a extemlly large amount of data minutes used thus u must be useing it for a modem blah blah blah :bang: :bang:

I have seen only one person get this letter. Have you personally honestly got the letter as well?

[CAIN505]

A recent review of your Sprint pcs account noted a unusually large amount of data useage with your sprint pcs phone. In our experience usage of this lvl is typically the result of useing the phone as a modem. Using yur sprint pcs phone as a modem in connection with any other device(computers, ect) is stricly prohibited under the terms of your (and i quote) ulimited sprint pcs vision plan.

To the extent you wish to continue useing your sprint pcs phone as a modem, you will need to change your sprint pcs vision plan. sprint offersa number of data only plans, which are similar to our voice plans, where by you are alotted a certain number of megabytes for a recurring charge. These data plans are in addition to the voice calling plan that you have on your phone.

Please note that continuing to use your sprint pcs phone as a modem on your current (here is that word again) unlimiteded sprint pcs vision plan is not an option and my result in cancellation of your sprint pcs vision service.

To find out more call us visit us on the web blah blah blah.

We apologize for any confusion and thank you for yur continued bussiness.

(does that answer yur question)

[3G Cables]

A recent review of your Sprint pcs account noted a unusually large amount of data useage with your sprint pcs phone. In our experience usage of this lvl is typically the result of useing the phone as a modem. Using yur sprint pcs phone as a modem in connection with any other device(computers, ect) is stricly prohibited under the terms of your (and i quote) ulimited sprint pcs vision plan.

To the extent you wish to continue useing your sprint pcs phone as a modem, you will need to change your sprint pcs vision plan. sprint offersa number of data only plans, which are similar to our voice plans, where by you are alotted a certain number of megabytes for a recurring charge. These data plans are in addition to the voice calling plan that you have on your phone.

Please note that continuing to use your sprint pcs phone as a modem on your current (here is that word again) unlimiteded sprint pcs vision plan is not an option and my result in cancellation of your sprint pcs vision service.

To find out more call us visit us on the web blah blah blah.

We apologize for any confusion and thank you for yur continued bussiness.

(does that answer yur question)

I appreciate you taking the time to type that out but that does not answer my question.

I have seen those exact words elsewhere I just wanted to know if you actually got one. A "yes" or "no" and if "yes" how much data were you using?

Thanks

[CAIN505]

im not sure how much data i was useing but they are referring to the amout of data minutes i had, i have been using my phone for EQ for about a year now, but also i just got a laptop and i was using my phone for that, and my moms machine, my brothers machine, practically everywhere i went i had the LT with me and i was getting on the net and that im sure racks up quite a few minutes

[frontsideinc]

I appreciate you taking the time to type that out but that does not answer my question.

I have seen those exact words elsewhere I just wanted to know if you actually got one. A "yes" or "no" and if "yes" how much data were you using?

Thanks

Hey 3G cables, I got this very same letter.. as seen here

http://www.sprintusers.com/forum/showthread.php?t=70277

I used about 3 gigs of data since aug of o4.

they gave me a the 20mb for 20 bucks a month, to use the data cable, but its unlimited for the first 3 months, after that 3 months is up,

Im going to add another phone to my plan and use it for the data cable,,but going to use it lightly, so i dont trigger the sprint police again,,,

[3G Cables]

Hey 3G cables, I got this very same letter.. as seen here

http://www.sprintusers.com/forum/showthread.php?t=70277

I used about 3 gigs of data since aug of o4.

they gave me a the 20mb for 20 bucks a month, to use the data cable, but its unlimited for the first 3 months, after that 3 months is up,

Im going to add another phone to my plan and use it for the data cable,,but going to use it lightly, so i dont trigger the sprint police again,,,

Yea, you were the other person I was referring to in the previous post.

So you used only 3 Gigs in 1 year and got that letter? I was using about 500MB's a month but off and on and didn’t get anything.

I think the bottom line is, if you don’t use it on a regular basis, and don’t use large amounts in any small time period they don’t care.

It is still a mystery to everyone what actually triggers the audit and that is what I am trying to figure out.

[frontsideinc]

Yea, you were the other person I was referring to in the previous post.

So you used only 3 Gigs in 1 year and got that letter? I was using about 500MB's a month but off and on and didn’t get anything.

I think the bottom line is, if you don’t use it on a regular basis, and don’t use large amounts in any small time period they don’t care.

It is still a mystery to everyone what actually triggers the audit and that is what I am trying to figure out.


Maybe one day someone will find out for sure what triggers it..cause I really want to know.

[CAIN505]

i dont think its a matter of how much data you download but more a matter of how many mins you use 3months ago i downloaded 10 300meg demos that was all +/- 500megs and nothing from them at all then i started using my phone with my main machine my laptop my moms machine my bro's machine all through my cell and a week ago i got that letter so logically i presume if you use a certain number of minutes that no sane person would ever use on just their phone that i think is what triggers the flag of whoa everyone look at this the reason i say that is also because for the past year i have been using it for EQ for an average of 4 hours a night but if you multiply that by 4-5 per night it would come up to about 16 hours a day and i wouldn't think so but i seriously dought any of you use yur phone by itsself on the internet 16-18 hours a day and that i ernestly believe is what triggered the flag with me its still a guessing game for them because if they ever called me on it well (i use my phone for bussiness and i have about 20+ contacts that i use msn messenger with in order to trouble shoot computer related problems with these people have nothing better to do but to call me, IM me, text me u name it because they are have somesort of problem with their computer) and i would further state that "f they dont like me using so many data minutes though last i heard i had a infinate amount ill just switch to another carrier that wont harrass me so goddamn much"and i bet they leave me alone after that

[3G Cables]

i dont think its a matter of how much data you download but more a matter of how many mins you use 3months ago i downloaded 10 300meg demos that was all +/- 500megs and nothing from them at all then i started using my phone with my main machine my laptop my moms machine my bro's machine all through my cell and a week ago i got that letter so logically i presume if you use a certain number of minutes that no sane person would ever use on just their phone that i think is what triggers the flag of whoa everyone look at this the reason i say that is also because for the past year i have been using it for EQ for an average of 4 hours a night but if you multiply that by 4-5 per night it would come up to about 16 hours a day and i wouldn't think so but i seriously dought any of you use yur phone by itsself on the internet 16-18 hours a day and that i ernestly believe is what triggered the flag with me its still a guessing game for them because if they ever called me on it well (i use my phone for bussiness and i have about 20+ contacts that i use msn messenger with in order to trouble shoot computer related problems with these people have nothing better to do but to call me, IM me, text me u name it because they are have somesort of problem with their computer) and i would further state that "f they dont like me using so many data minutes though last i heard i had a infinate amount ill just switch to another carrier that wont harrass me so goddamn much"and i bet they leave me alone after that

They do not track Vision usage in minutes but since you were on so long, it is a data issue as well.

There is no other carrier that will let you download the kind of data you are talking about without paying over $80 per month so I would look into that before telling Sprint to shove it because they will tell you "go ahead". They are dicks about this kind of thing and will not bow down to you or anyone else making that threat. I wish that was the case but it doesn’t work that way.

[Storino03]

Actually, I have something to add. This was a test I did several weeks ago. I was playing an online game (Phantasy Star Online: Blue Burst) using my cell phone. The data transferred in roughly an hour of playing the game was a mere 1.5MB...that's right, ONE POINT FIVE MEGA-BYTES. The download rate was much smaller than that.

So, my question to you is, if it's that low of a data transfer, and you are connected to (technically PCS Vision) through your phone, how would they differentiate that, even though it was an hour of being active online?

Furthermore, the data rate wasn't even going all the time--it was more of a stop and go type of thing.

[3G Cables]

Actually, I have something to add. This was a test I did several weeks ago. I was playing an online game (Phantasy Star Online: Blue Burst) using my cell phone. The data transferred in roughly an hour of playing the game was a mere 1.5MB...that's right, ONE POINT FIVE MEGA-BYTES. The download rate was much smaller than that.

So, my question to you is, if it's that low of a data transfer, and you are connected to (technically PCS Vision) through your phone, how would they differentiate that, even though it was an hour of being active online?

Furthermore, the data rate wasn't even going all the time--it was more of a stop and go type of thing.

That all depends what you are doing on-line. For you, you were playing a vector based game so it only sent vector values. In other words, that game does not sent graphics back and forth or sound or any other large value of media or data. All of that information is on your local computer. So when you move your character to the *left* it sends a vector or numerical value to the server you are playing your game on such as a Hex value of *2B* which tells the server and everyone else connected to your on-line game that you just moved *left*. To send that *2B* took less than 1k of data to send.

However, if you were streaming video or downloading some large porn or something, then there would be a lot of data used especially if it was not compressed.

Some people here think that Sprint doesn’t know how you connect; they are dead wrong. Sprint can tell if you are connected directly via the handset or if you are connect with a cable.

How you ask? Well, connecting directly with a handset you get sent to through the Vision gateway where the ESN of your phone is sent as well as if there is another device connecting.

So if you connect with a data cable, you still get sent through the Vision gateway however it can tell you have a computer or other device connected and that data is sent as well. All the data is logged and they can most certainly tell what IP’s/websites you have been going to. But bottom line, who cares? They do not look at any of this info (they do not have enough man power to look at everyone’s browsing habits and they don’t care) they will however review your account if you have prolonged high data usage. Some people claim they have downloaded movies all day. That is fine, but if it keeps up for long periods of time and months later you get a “stop it” letter, you will know why. It takes a few months of high data usage usually before the people get a letter but that threshold is what we are trying to figure out. It may be a data used issue or a time issue or both,

Hope that explains everything in detail.

[Storino03]

Yes it does, actually. Data is only sent when I move my character around or there are other characters on-screen and moving/talking. :)

[jamgar]

If you can get on the business plan they sell unlimited use with the pc card for $80 a month, still pretty expensive. Verizon is coming out with a new service like this with broadband speeds.

[3G Cables]

If you can get on the business plan they sell unlimited use with the pc card for $80 a month, still pretty expensive. Verizon is coming out with a new service like this with broadband speeds.

Verizon has had it for a long time. Sprint is just coming out with thier EV-DO now.

[Clash]

If you can get on the business plan they sell unlimited use with the pc card for $80 a month, still pretty expensive. Verizon is coming out with a new service like this with broadband speeds.

Sprint also already has this. Just the cards. Its called Ev-do.... although I think that if I were to get a card, I'd wait until Ev-do Rev. A (I've heard from around this board Q4 2005 or Q1 2006).... better downloads and much faster uploads.... yummy :-)

[CAIN505]

thought about just ending my sprint service and just getting a cable modem with as a extra service $20 USD internet telephone granted i wouldnt be moble but i wouldn't have to worry about the constant possibility of lossing service to this crap and it certainly would be cheaper than an extra $80 a month crap and a hell of alot less hassle

[hecticmom]

so if you have a connectivity kit how does one go about accessing the web thru our cell phone for occasional use? Is there a special phone number or ? my husband is lost

[FloorMatt]

so if you have a connectivity kit how does one go about accessing the web thru our cell phone for occasional use? Is there a special phone number or ? my husband is lost

#777 is the number you'll have the computer dial.

What kind of kit is it? Perhaps you can try a search of this forum section for info on the kit you have?

[CAIN505]

http://www.futuredial.com this says it all, You need a computer, you need the drivers for yur particular phone installed on yur machine u need a cable to go from you machine to you phone (sprint prefered all others charge for minutes or KB's d/l'ed) i use a Vi660 and i got my cable from the local Radio Shack store then i proceeded to rewire it a bit so that it charges my phone off of the usb port as well as on the net you dont need the $40USD program they try to sell with it just the drivers which u can get from http://www.futuredial.com too u then just setup a new connection in dial-up networking set it to use the modem tell it to dial #777(sprint) and uncheck the box that refers to "use dialing rules" because it will try to dial 918-#777 or whatever your area code is and that just wont work you then will connect at 115K/sec which is also real close to slow dsl and that is all there is to it. you can breath now

[3G Cables]

http://www.futuredial.com this says it all, You need a computer, you need the drivers for yur particular phone installed on yur machine u need a cable to go from you machine to you phone (sprint prefered all others charge for minutes or KB's d/l'ed) i use a Vi660 and i got my cable from the local Radio Shack store then i proceeded to rewire it a bit so that it charges my phone off of the usb port as well as on the net you dont need the $40USD program they try to sell with it just the drivers which u can get from http://www.futuredial.com too u then just setup a new connection in dial-up networking set it to use the modem tell it to dial #777(sprint) and uncheck the box that refers to "use dialing rules" because it will try to dial 918-#777 or whatever your area code is and that just wont work you then will connect at 115K/sec which is also real close to slow dsl and that is all there is to it. you can breath now

Or we sell the EXACT OEM cable that Futuredial sells for $8.95 when they are charging $29.99. The choice is yours.

Also we explain the whole dialing process which Cain just did above on a sheet of paper which comes with the cable.

[3G Cables]

http://www.futuredial.com this says it all, You need a computer, you need the drivers for yur particular phone installed on yur machine u need a cable to go from you machine to you phone (sprint prefered all others charge for minutes or KB's d/l'ed) i use a Vi660 and i got my cable from the local Radio Shack store then i proceeded to rewire it a bit so that it charges my phone off of the usb port as well as on the net you dont need the $40USD program they try to sell with it just the drivers which u can get from http://www.futuredial.com too u then just setup a new connection in dial-up networking set it to use the modem tell it to dial #777(sprint) and uncheck the box that refers to "use dialing rules" because it will try to dial 918-#777 or whatever your area code is and that just wont work you then will connect at 115K/sec which is also real close to slow dsl and that is all there is to it. you can breath now

Thanks for that explanation yet you missed the whole point of the thread which was "sprint-vision for laptop use? Sprints fuzzy issue... "

[CAIN505]

yeah i know but it was more for the post or two just in front of my last post before this one

[mazcar]

I'm not understanding something here, and the fast talkers at Sprint aren't helping.
If I have a Treo, for example, and don't pay for any service other than air time, can't I still email a message or a picture in a message to an internet email address by simply using my dial-up isp? The only penalty would be air time usage, right? I figure I would rarely use this feature, so I'd rather pay as I go rather than pay and rarely use. I understand I can shell out $10 or $15 a month and use Vision if under 150mb, but that's still $120-180 per year! Even Wireless Web (if they still offer it) would be $60 per year. I'd rather take my lumps with actual air time if that's allowed. Besides, weekends would rock. Is the connection speed the same with Vision, Wireless Web, or just calling my 56k isp?

Come to think of it, can I buy an eight dollar data cable for my ancient Samsung 8500 (what's 2g or 3g anyway?) and connect it to my Palm or Pocket PC or laptop with just air time as a penalty? Obviously I haven't tried this in six years of being with Sprint, but it would be nice to know.

The Sprint gang, besides hiding Free and Clear also make it a point to be as vague as possible on internet connectivety options. The certainly don't mention if the old Wireless Web for $5 still exists and what are the TOS and what hardware is compatible with it. Or any ala carte by the minute or kb plans, either. My old Chinese roommate told me once that at the restaurants back home they don't use menus; you just have to know what to ask for. Is that the Sprint model?

Office Max has the Treo 650 for $200 with activation to Earthlink wireless (no thanks), but $300 without activation. Sprint wants $450. Jeez, I can buy two kegs and invite you guys over for the $150 difference. Can I buy one of those (I guess they have to be CDMA) and activate it through Sprint and just pay for air time as mentioned above?

I know this thread started with discussion of Vision and laptops, but I think this is somewhat related.

"Don't hate me because I am beautiful. Hate me because I'm a *****!" - Sam Kinison on Kelly LeBrock's shampoo commercial.

[sheureka]

If I have a Treo, for example, and don't pay for any service other than air time, can't I still email a message or a picture in a message to an internet email address by simply using my dial-up isp?You can't dial your ISP using a Treo, or any of the other currently available Vision phones. If you could figure out a way to do it, Sprint would charge you 39 cents a minute for 14.4 speed. You can use the Vision features of your phone without a Vision plan, but it costs 0.02/kb (??) and can add up really, really, fast.I understand I can shell out $10 or $15 a month and use Vision if under 150mbThere's no limit on Vision (using it on the phone) if you have a Vision package.Is the connection speed the same with Vision, Wireless Web, or just calling my 56k isp?Wireless web or calling your ISP max out at 14.4; Vision maxes out at 144 (but usually runs 70 to 90).Come to think of it, can I buy an eight dollar data cable for my ancient Samsung 8500 (what's 2g or 3g anyway?) and connect it to my Palm or Pocket PC or laptop with just air time as a penalty? Obviously I haven't tried this in six years of being with Sprint, but it would be nice to know.I don't know whether Sprint will still activate your old Samsung or not - if they did you'd either have to get the $5 wireless web plan, or pay 39 cents a minute. Again, you'd be limited to 14.4 kbps.
Office Max has the Treo 650 for $200 with activation to Earthlink wireless (no thanks), but $300 without activation. Sprint wants $450.The Earthlink Treo can't be activated on Sprint. - sheureka

[3G Cables]

You can't dial your ISP using a Treo, or any of the other currently available Vision phones. If you could figure out a way to do it, Sprint would charge you 39 cents a minute for 14.4 speed. You can use the Vision features of your phone without a Vision plan, but it costs 0.02/kb (??) and can add up really, really, fast.There's no limit on Vision (using it on the phone) if you have a Vision package.Wireless web or calling your ISP max out at 14.4; Vision maxes out at 144 (but usually runs 70 to 90).I don't know whether Sprint will still activate your old Samsung or not - if they did you'd either have to get the $5 wireless web plan, or pay 39 cents a minute. Again, you'd be limited to 14.4 kbps.
The Earthlink Treo can't be activated on Sprint. - sheureka

Very well said. I dont think Sprint will allow new activations for Wireless Web.

Deval, can you answer that?

[monkeyboy]

I don't know whether Sprint will still activate your old Samsung or not - if they did you'd either have to get the $5 wireless web plan, or pay 39 cents a minute. Again, you'd be limited to 14.4 kbps.
Well, not as simple as that. I don't believe it was ever possible to simply have a phone for WW only. Therefore you'd have to put the Samsung on a voice plan, add the $5/mo for WW and burn up the voice plan minutes for your WW data usage. I doubt you'd come out ahead...
You can't dial your ISP using a Treo, or any of the other currently available Vision phones.mmm... I've done 2G WW-style data on my i500... by the same token, fax'ing, which uses 2G CDMA modem'ing works on the i500 also. Yes, it cost $0.39/min...

[leaving_ash]

Well as Sprint no longer sells 2G data phones the old WW plans are not to be made available for new activations/new lines (began phasing these out several months ago). You would have to do some fancy CS work to get it applied.

[monkeyboy]

Well as Sprint no longer sells 2G data phones the old WW plans are not to be made available for new activations/new lines (began phasing these out several months ago). You would have to do some fancy CS work to get it applied.Are you saying that Sprint will no longer activate a Kyocera 2035 or 6035 ? That would be big news to all the folks trading such phones on ebay...

[3G Cables]

Are you saying that Sprint will no longer activate a Kyocera 2035 or 6035 ? That would be big news to all the folks trading such phones on ebay...

Sure, they will activate it but you wont be able to use the wireless web unlimited. You will be charged 39 cents per minute and use up your airtime.

[monkeyboy]

Sure, they will activate it but you wont be able to use the wireless web unlimited. You will be charged 39 cents per minute and use up your airtime.mmm... its never been "and", its always been "or", i.e. be charged $0.39/min OR use up your airtime (if you have WW on your plan).

So what you're saying is that they will no longer add WW to a person's plan/account, even if its a 2G phone. OK... that seems a little strange, but OK, if you say so...

Why strange ? because it is counterintuitive. On one hand, they will charge you $0.39/min. That means that they will be keeping the service/facility for the near future. But then they would *prefer* to charge you $0.39/min instead of having you sign up for WW ? They *always* prefer that you sign up for a plan/option that invokes a monthly recurring charge. And it is *not* unlimited WW, because it consumes your airtime minutes.

Oh well, I gave up my 2G phones a couple years ago, so its unlikely that I'll be testing this issue... I may be testing the limits of Sprint's Shortmail support, though... Let's see which will come first: Sprint shutting down Shortmail or Sprint offering a phone that is a reasonable upgrade/replacement for the i500...

[3G Cables]

mmm... its never been "and", its always been "or", i.e. be charged $0.39/min OR use up your airtime (if you have WW on your plan).

So what you're saying is that they will no longer add WW to a person's plan/account, even if its a 2G phone. OK... that seems a little strange, but OK, if you say so...

Why strange ? because it is counterintuitive. On one hand, they will charge you $0.39/min. That means that they will be keeping the service/facility for the near future. But then they would *prefer* to charge you $0.39/min instead of having you sign up for WW ? They *always* prefer that you sign up for a plan/option that invokes a monthly recurring charge. And it is *not* unlimited WW, because it consumes your airtime minutes.

Oh well, I gave up my 2G phones a couple years ago, so its unlikely that I'll be testing this issue... I may be testing the limits of Sprint's Shortmail support, though... Let's see which will come first: Sprint shutting down Shortmail or Sprint offering a phone that is a reasonable upgrade/replacement for the i500...

That is correct. They will no longer add Vision/WWW to a persons account with a 2G phone because it is NOT POSSIBLE. A 2G phone does not support Vision. They USE to offer the “Wireless Web” option for 2G phones but not anymore.

Thus, if you have a 2G phone you can still connect but be charged BOTH 39 cents per minute AND use up your minutes. But that is even if you can do it. When you dial into a 2G network it goes through their modem pool NOT the regular Vision route. The modem pool is not offered everywhere and there is no plan to offer new modems at each tower in the future. They want people to get rid of their 2G phones and purchase 3G phones which is a very smart business decision because then they could get more monthly charged for Vision users.

That makes perfect sense.

[CAIN505]

also just fyi i did that but got a credit for like 30 bucks only because the CSR didnt know the difference data min's and infinate vision my logic to her was i have infinate internet why am i being charged for it of course i knew why but i didnt go into details and she bought it but i wont try to test it again thus if you try to use you voice minutes to connect to the web even on weekends it wont work it the system knows the difference between your voice and two machines and they will charge you for data minutes at the .39cents/min

[3G Cables]

also just fyi i did that but got a credit for like 30 bucks only because the CSR didnt know the difference data min's and infinate vision my logic to her was i have infinate internet why am i being charged for it of course i knew why but i didnt go into details and she bought it but i wont try to test it again thus if you try to use you voice minutes to connect to the web even on weekends it wont work it the system knows the difference between your voice and two machines and they will charge you for data minutes at the .39cents/min

Exactly, they know the difference because it goes through their modem pools.

[avalon]

I just helped a friend get "dialup" through their cingular phone and they call it "CSD". Cingular does NOT charge anything in most areas for CSD access! (Apparently this is equal to the old 2G "wireless web" from Sprint).

Too bad Sprint politics won't let us work that way without added charges. 14.4kbps access is just fine for short periods and would be great backup when cable modem is down, etc.

[3G Cables]

I just helped a friend get "dialup" through their cingular phone and they call it "CSD". Cingular does NOT charge anything in most areas for CSD access! (Apparently this is equal to the old 2G "wireless web" from Sprint).

Too bad Sprint politics won't let us work that way without added charges. 14.4kbps access is just fine for short periods and would be great backup when cable modem is down, etc.

They may not charge but it does come out of your minutes and that is a lot of minutes because the connection is so slow.

And 14.4k is fine for you but not most people. Sprint is strategically doing this to offer their higher speed network at a high price. It is rumored there will be better data plans on Sept 2nd. Let’s wait and see what they will have to offer us then. It is fairly soon.

[Jonger1150]

I have been connecting my treo 650 to a laptop for months now. I get 144kps speeds and I havent heard a thing from Sprint. Theres lots of people doing this right now on a treo messageboard.

[monkeyboy]

They may not charge but it does come out of your minutes and that is a lot of minutes because the connection is so slow.

And 14.4k is fine for you but not most people. For many phones, 14.4k is about all the slow CPU of these phones can handle. Indeed many users of the 7135 PDA phone on VZW reported that 1xrtt was no faster than QNC (14.4k) for downloading email, websurfing, etc. For me, before Vision (1rxtt), I used Sprint's WW (QNC) at 14.4k for email usage and found it entirely adequate (for email). As far as being charged for airtime under QNC-MOU, many VZW people use QNC on nights and weekends and thus that airtime for data usage is free and unlimited.

[3G Cables]

For many phones, 14.4k is about all the slow CPU of these phones can handle. Indeed many users of the 7135 PDA phone on VZW reported that 1xrtt was no faster than QNC (14.4k) for downloading email, websurfing, etc. For me, before Vision (1rxtt), I used Sprint's WW (QNC) at 14.4k for email usage and found it entirely adequate (for email). As far as being charged for airtime under QNC-MOU, many VZW people use QNC on nights and weekends and thus that airtime for data usage is free and unlimited.

Thats cool, whatever works for you. Most people use primetime minutes and do care about speeds better than 14.4k/sec. Again, whatever works for you is great :)

[sprinthater]

I use my phone when on the road as a modem, and I have unlimited vision service, occasionally and there is no pattern as to when/how/why they bill me, but sometimes I get casual vision charges when I do use my phone as a modem, I just call them and ask why I was charged casually for vision when I have an unlimited plan and the reps all seem bewildered and dont know why, (obviously they have no real reliable way to track it) they just credit the casual usage.

[coolgreany]

No nasty grams for me over the last year.

[SirThoreth]

You can't dial your ISP using a Treo, or any of the other currently available Vision phones. If you could figure out a way to do it, Sprint would charge you 39 cents a minute for 14.4 speed.

Yup. That was even the case on my old Qualcomm 1960 on the Pioneer Plan, which is funny, 'cause my data costs were barely any higher than my voice. I used to dial my friend's ISP with it on occasion, in order to download email to my HP 360LX palmtop (which runs Windows CE 2.0).


You can use the Vision features of your phone without a Vision plan, but it costs 0.02/kb (??) and can add up really, really, fast.


Um, ow. :indiff:


There's no limit on Vision (using it on the phone) if you have a Vision package.Wireless web or calling your ISP max out at 14.4; Vision maxes out at 144 (but usually runs 70 to 90).I don't know whether Sprint will still activate your old Samsung or not - if they did you'd either have to get the $5 wireless web plan, or pay 39 cents a minute. Again, you'd be limited to 14.4 kbps.
The Earthlink Treo can't be activated on Sprint. - sheureka

IIRC, someone recently reactivated a Qualcomm 2700 on Sprint, so reactivating an old Samsung meant for Sprint should be doable. As for WW? *shrug*

I have been connecting my treo 650 to a laptop for months now. I get 144kps speeds and I havent heard a thing from Sprint. Theres lots of people doing this right now on a treo messageboard.


I suspect this is because the Treo 650, like the PPC 6600/6601, already connect like a computer, rather than a phone. The browser on a Pocket PC uses IE5 (earlier versions of WinCE used an IE4-based browser, which is how it reports to a web server), if I recall correctly, as its core, and the Treo is, IIRC, Opera-based (though it reports as a Palm-specific browser to a web server).

My suspicion, then, is that Sprint's network has no way to differentiate between when your Treo or PPC 6600 is calling #777 for surfing on the phone itself, or when you're surfing on your laptop and using your Treo as a modem. Basically, these two devices are computers that happen to have phones built in, and already show up as a computer when surfing.

What I do know is that my PPC 6601 absolutely dials #777 when I surf the web. I also know that the software to allow me to use it as a modem (connecting via serial, IR, USB or Bluetooth) was bundled with my 6601. I haven't tried it with my laptop yet (I did try it via IR with an NEC MobilePro 880, which runs Win CE 2.11, but was unsuccessful in getting it to work), but intend to do so soon.

[kgodwin12]

Somewhere I have the web pages from Sprint site from years ago when I used my Qualcom phone to my Aero handheld. Those pages said specifically that I could use sprint service and my phone as modem to connect my devices.

I still use my LG5350 for my handheld (serial) and my notebook (usb). Have never gotten any letter from "police" and, well keep trying to keep looking for phone that can do the same for me.

I dont know what is with Sprint and service. One would think that they would allow so much download - they might just find that they can increase sales. who knows

[Terry61656]

Can you please explain how much 150-200 megs of use might be in a month? Is it normal surfing and downloading e-mail maybe an hour a day (so 30 hours). Please assume that I am not downloading MP3's and Applications or uploading 100 pictures to an online photo album.

[3G Cables]

Can you please explain how much 150-200 megs of use might be in a month? Is it normal surfing and downloading e-mail maybe an hour a day (so 30 hours). Please assume that I am not downloading MP3's and Applications or uploading 100 pictures to an online photo album.

No, there is no way to tell. Some websites have just a few kb’s of data and some have several megs.

You will need to take the responsibility and monitor it yourself.

Here is an application that will count the data for you http://www.download.com/GPRS-Traffic-Counter/3000-2153_4-10283752.html?tag=lst-0-2

It is a 45 day free trial which is more than enough time to get a feel for how much your browsing habits add up.

EDIT: I just realized that software is for Smartphones only. Someone please feel free to post a data kb counter for the PC.

[sprinthater]

It would be around 50 dollars a month, you would be better of paying 15 bucks for unlimited vision.

[paulpv]

Wow, this is an old thread!

If you use Sprint's dialup software then it will tell you how much bandwidth you used that session.
I think there is a phone number you can call to have it tell you how much data you have used total.

How does the content of this entire thread change now that there is a $25/mo "Phone As Modem" power vision plan (supposedly 40MB free, then a cap at $70)?

I have also read in another thread that if your primary phone is vision enabled, your secondary phone's power vision will be 50% off.

$12.50/mo, and perhaps the $70 max can also be 50% off (it wouldn't surprise me if it is *not* but it does not really make sense for them to not discount that usage too)

All this on an EVDO phone.
That's pretty spectacular...and now 100% allowed by the contract!

Pv

[3G Cables]

Wow, this is an old thread!

If you use Sprint's dialup software then it will tell you how much bandwidth you used that session.
I think there is a phone number you can call to have it tell you how much data you have used total.

How does the content of this entire thread change now that there is a $25/mo "Phone As Modem" power vision plan (supposedly 40MB free, then a cap at $70)?

I have also read in another thread that if your primary phone is vision enabled, your secondary phone's power vision will be 50% off.

$12.50/mo, and perhaps the $70 max can also be 50% off (it wouldn't surprise me if it is *not* but it does not really make sense for them to not discount that usage too)

All this on an EVDO phone.
That's pretty spectacular...and now 100% allowed by the contract!

Pv

You are correct about "...now that there is a $25/mo "Phone As Modem" power vision plan (supposedly 40MB free, then a cap at $70)?"

So in other words the most you will pay for unlimited Vision no matter what is $70 and that is a GREAT deal if you have EV-DO. But alot of people expect way less. Too bad for them that is not the deal.

[Sprint4EverBaby]

You are correct about "...now that there is a $25/mo "Phone As Modem" power vision plan (supposedly 40MB free, then a cap at $70)?"

So in other words the most you will pay for unlimited Vision no matter what is $70 and that is a GREAT deal if you have EV-DO. But alot of people expect way less. Too bad for them that is not the deal.

I just ordered my cable from you guys for my vm4500. I hope I got the right one. ;) Anyway, I am looking forward to the added freedom this is gonna give me when I go down to visit my friend in Richmond, VA. He only has dial-up so it would be fun to blow him out of the water using my celly as modem.

[Panoramic]

I sat down at the PC tonight to do one thing: to determine what Sprint equipment to purchase to give my new Bluetooth-enabled laptop wireless web access for the cheapest price. After several hours of reading this thread and following the links within it and reading the information there as well, I've decided to broaden the scope of my search to other wireless providers, not only for my laptop's wireless access, but also for my own voice access. The history of this issue, connecting a PC to a cellphone, and Sprint's stance on it, both "official" TOS stance and "unofficial" (lies and deception, you say?) stance by its *official* salespeople, sicken me.

My first Sprint phone was purchased in 1999. Never having the time to do much research since then, something in the back of my mind nevertheless kept itching: "Am I getting screwed? Are there better deals out there?" The very-interesting history of this issue, as illustrated within this thread, has shown me that, while I personally may not be getting screwed (I don't know that yet), Sprint is certainly a company capable of doing it.

Case in point:
Let alone what's "legal" according to the TOS, as so many people have mentioned here. For the moment set aside questions of Sprint's ability to know how we connect, also widely discussed here. And look at one simple fact: bandwidth used to download or stream data to a handheld device USES THE SAME AMOUNT OF SPRINT RESOURCES as the same bandwidth used to download or stream the same data to a cellphone-connected laptop.

Don't give me the standard company line of "a laptop user uses more bandwidth," please. I said SAME BANDWIDTH used for the SAME DATA. I said it this way for a reason: as "SmartPhone/PDA" type devices get more powerful, they are already providing many applications that, formerly, had to be done on a PC. This means MORE BANDWIDTH. And as they get more powerful, they will only consume more. There is at least one author within this thread who was contacted by Sprint for streaming music and/or video to his handheld device, thinking it was a connected PC because of the large amount of data transfer. The actual difference between this fellow and a user connected with a laptop through a Sprint phone? Only what's in Sprint's arbitrary definition of what's "right" and "wrong," NOT what creates more of a drain on Sprint's resources or not.

With this logical insight, one has to ask: Sprint, why *do* you treat laptop/cellphone users differently *if they use the same amount of data transfer as SmartPhone Vision users?* The old and obvious reason: MONEY. Money for its proprietary PCMCIA cards. Money for the $80 business service to use the card. And now money for these new plans offering 20Mb for $20 per month (or 50Mb or whatever) of data transfer. Note that this is for something that many, many people within this very thread, a thread of two years(!), have been admittedly getting (actually, it's more like 150-200Mb per month) FOR FREE with absolutely no repercussions from Sprint.

In TWO WHOLE YEARS of this thread, there have been a grand total of TWO people who've come forward with "nasty notes" from Sprint. Ohhh, and the link to only one other SPECIFIC individual who got charged a lot of cash (as opposed to so much hearsay).

Is the chance there to "get caught and lynched" by Sprint, like so many Chicken-Little types on this thread who are F - A - S - T to point out (Sprint Deceptioner Spy-Priests, you say?)? Sure. But, armed with all the stuff I've read here, what would it matter to me if Sprint threatened to boot me, a man who is now considering leaving anyway? None at all. Money, you say? That I've got. $150 early termination fee? No problem! The sneaky and underhanded number portability fee? No problem! I'm willing to spend the money if it will get me out of a business contract with a company I no longer trust and into one with a company that I do.

Which reminds me, I'm taking it upon myself to research the offerings of other companies when it comes to combined cost of the data and voice package that I'm after, and the equipment needed to implement it. Their networks aren't so good, you say? We'll find that out, I say. I'm a paid technical researcher. Maybe I'll post my findings in the "other providers" forum and post a link here.

Panoramic

[Panoramic]

I sat down at the PC tonight to do one thing: to determine what Sprint equipment to purchase to give my new Bluetooth-enabled laptop wireless web access. After several hours of reading this thread and following the links within it and reading the information there as well, I've decided to broaden the scope of my search to other wireless providers, not only for my laptop's wireless access, but also for my own voice access. The history of this issue, connecting a PC to a cellphone, and Sprint's stance on it, both "official" TOS stance and "unofficial" (lies and deception, you say?) stance by its *official* salespeople, sicken me.

My first Sprint phone was purchased in 1999. Never having the time to do much research since then, something in the back of my mind nevertheless kept itching: "Am I getting screwed? Are there better deals out there?" The very-interesting history of this issue, as illustrated within this thread, has shown me that, while I personally may not be getting screwed (I don't know that yet), Sprint is certainly a company capable of doing it.

Case in point:
Let alone what's "legal" according to the TOS, as so many people have mentioned here. For the moment set aside questions of Sprint's ability to know how we connect, also widely discussed here. And look at one simple fact: bandwidth used to download or stream data to a handheld device USES THE SAME AMOUNT OF SPRINT RESOURCES as the same bandwidth used to download or stream the same data to a cellphone-connected laptop.

Don't give me the standard company line of "a laptop user uses more bandwidth," please. I said SAME BANDWIDTH used for the SAME DATA. I said it this way for a reason: as "SmartPhone/PDA" type devices get more powerful, they are already providing many applications that, formerly, had to be done on a PC. This means MORE BANDWIDTH. And as they get more powerful, they will only consume more. There is at least one author within this thread who was contacted by Sprint for streaming music and/or video to his handheld device, thinking it was a connected PC because of the large amount of data transfer. The actual difference between this fellow and a user connected with a laptop through a Sprint phone? Only what's in Sprint's arbitrary definition of what's "right" and "wrong," NOT what creates more of a drain on Sprint's resources or not.

With this logical insight, one has to ask: Sprint, why *do* you treat laptop/cellphone users differently *if they use the same amount of data transfer as SmartPhone Vision users?* The old and obvious reason: MONEY. Money for its proprietary PCMCIA cards. Money for the $80 business service to use the card. And now money for these new plans offering 20Mb for $20 per month (or 50Mb or whatever) of data transfer. Note that this is for something that many, many people within this very thread, a thread of two years(!), have been admittedly getting (actually, it's more like 150-200Mb per month) FOR FREE with absolutely no repercussions from Sprint.

In TWO WHOLE YEARS of this thread, there have been a grand total of TWO people who've come forward with "nasty notes" from Sprint. Ohhh, and the link to only one other SPECIFIC individual who got charged a lot of cash (as opposed to so much hearsay).

Is the chance there to "get caught and lynched" by Sprint, like so many Chicken-Little types on this thread who are F - A - S - T to point out (Sprint Deceptioner Spy-Priests, you say?)? Sure. But, armed with all the stuff I've read here, what would it matter to me if Sprint threatened to boot me, a man who is now considering leaving anyway? None at all. Money, you say? That I've got. $150 early termination fee? No problem! The sneaky and underhanded number portability fee? No problem! I'm willing to spend the money if it will get me out of a business contract with a company I no longer trust and into one with a company that I do.

Which reminds me, I'm taking it upon myself to research the offerings of other companies when it comes to combined cost of the data and voice package that I'm after, and the equipment needed to implement it. Their networks aren't so good, you say? We'll find that out, I say. I'm a paid technical researcher. Maybe I'll post my findings in the "other providers" forum and post a link here.

Panoramic

[Panoramic]

P.S. Seeing what THIS guy said:

http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/wlg/5791

. . . and Sprint's response to it:

http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/wlg/5825

. . . really makes Sprint look bad considering that, after this guy's comments, nothing was done to remedy the situation (note the date of Sprint's reply) except for much MUCH later, to offer new packages that massively overcharge its laptop / cell phone users when compared to its Vision / handheld device users.

I just can't get over this. Writing this has given me the motivation to get my VI-2300 hacked to use #777 (something ELSE trusty-old, customer-centric-old Sprint has done is get the manufacturer to disable a perfectly good feature of its product that DOES work for other providers) and, once hacked, use it with metering software to go online for 200MB per month or less, much like many others have reported being OK with. Just to satisfy my curiosity of "will I get busted?" or "will I not?" Help me out with information to hikingnola@aol.com concerning firmware hacks for the VI-2300, where to get? who to ask? (there's at least ONE person in the world who knows how: the guy who disabled the feature to begin with!) and I promise I'll post my results in as scientific a manner as possible.

[rmship]

I'm holding my breath, July 18th I will know if i'm charged or not, I use PDAnet